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[Music]

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explore the bazaar your e-ticket ride is

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the world of the paranormal Sofia as we

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traverse the universe exploring the

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unexplained UFO ghost lost world

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cryptozoology as well as other

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dimensions it's time to take back the

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night last night now your electrifying

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hosts of exploring the bizarre Timothy

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Begley and teams wars again what five

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one five just passing three thousand

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three two thousand five hundred on our

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left is this is a stationary small white

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light ground or no level is that food a

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half thousand feet around about what

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five hundred we just needed to our level

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well there's nothing on radar no

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aircraft driver however look outside a

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song yeah those looking at it wondering

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what it was quite straight but full

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quite light seems to be stationary okay

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but you didn't shoot any more now those

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gone down we just gave the clouds now

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but it was just

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they they they were all around us I mean

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we were picking them up on that on the

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radar there was about five or six of

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them on on one side of the scope and

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then it scanned over to the other side

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these are not temperature inversions

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you know I'm up here with the control

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operators and and we're watching these

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things and on the on the radar screen

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and I know we sent our planes up to

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chase them over the Capitol and this is

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this is just fantastic these things are

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going right over the White House it's

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unbelievable this will go down in

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history I'm sure I have a visual

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confirmation to him right on the tip of

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my wing believe Jill yes I love Tommy

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are you going to shoot at it oh no no

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don't shoot him that will just make a

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man I I would I would then they'll try

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to take over the White House and we

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certainly wouldn't want them to do that

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at this point we are now Tim yeah anyway

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enough for this enough enough of this

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chatter I guess they call it right yeah

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all right but where we're going to get

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serious tonight because this is what we

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do when we have a program on UFOs

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this is nuts and bolts night on the UFO

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the history of UFOs part two actually

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you might say yeah I think we can a and

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we're going to get some really good

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information and the reason that we were

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up here in the control tower is we're

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going to be discussing the 1952 UFO flap

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over Washington DC where the most

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important and well documented historical

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incidents in the whole history of a

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flying saucer research so Tim how you

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been out there in Jasper Indiana I've

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been doing well and you know I'm really

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happy that we have with us tonight

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dr. Arianna Scott she was gracious

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enough to

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and so we can continue our conversation

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which you and I both agreed the last

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time the Chu is on you know we certainly

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did not have enough time to talk with

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her well I see this as a a three part

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project at least I mean we're just

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getting into the 1950s and her book is

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just absolutely incredible I mean as far

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as the detail goes I would say it's one

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of the most important if not the most

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important historical works out there I

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agree I agree I mean it's the book is a

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very comprehensive and I mean there's

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just you know you open it up to any page

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and there'll be something on there that

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there you'll say well I didn't know that

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and we have a host who have with us this

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evening yet did well we also have with

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this raquel bird oh my really yes our

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good friend Rick who has been on our

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show a number of times now and and I

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think Tim you you said that Rick

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actually contributed the photographs for

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dr. Scott well I I believe they have

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been that in contact and correspondence

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and yes there's any number of pictures

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in the the book well we'll have to a ass

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Rick just how he has been involved in in

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in the in the project and the book's

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title it Tim is that dr. Scott has

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written it say UFOs today alright well

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it's a wonderful book and about years of

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Lies disinformation and government

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cover-up no 70 years of lies hard to

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believe isn't it what would the

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government lie to us I ask you whether I

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I no wonder I'm at a breath and it's not

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just running from the men in black it's

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from chasing UFOs and you know you got

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to be really a good to chase a UFO

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because they could go pretty darn

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fast dr. Scott how are you this evening

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just fine how are you well I'm living

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large right here in Manhattan and

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waiting for the saucers to to come over

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now when you were on the last time we we

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did I think get into the the Roswell

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crash and we talk somewhat about the

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angel hair but I did we we talked about

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it all you know some of the earliest

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sightings the one that's always

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intrigued me was of course the report by

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a captain that Thomas Mantell and then

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the subsequent crash of his plane and

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has his a death now did you do any

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in-depth research on that particular

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case uh I don't remember too well I

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think I did some and I think I most of

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the people thought he was I thought it

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was one of the big balloons that they

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were sending up then and what he said he

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saw a huge object metallic and that

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sounds like a balloon but there were

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some other reports of somebody in close

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to an airfield I forget what airfield

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that also saw an object and wondered

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about if that were true well now here's

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a little bit of information I have had a

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heard actual interviews with at least

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one member of Captain man tells a family

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and they are convinced to this day or to

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whatever the interview was conducted

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would have been a while ago now that he

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had a legitimate encounter with a UFO

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that it was not a balloon I mean I guess

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the the theory is is that he went up

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chasing this balloon and got to such a

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high altitude that he ran out of oxygen

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yeah that's the that's the normal

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explanation Jenny ran out of oxygen and

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then crashed but there were there were

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other of course this was in the the

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early days of the flying saucers

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appearing and it did

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receive I guess quite a bit of attention

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I mean I've seen the newspaper clippings

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from that period and there were any

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number of other reports that were coming

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in from around the country but I did

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want a Center at least the beginning of

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our conversation on the washington d.c

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if flat can can you give us a little bit

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of information how did that exactly get

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the going what happened was is that it

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involved UFOs actual relations capital

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which is a major thing and it in July

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1952 they had visual and radar based

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sightings that occurring in the

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Washington DC area including a national

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the Washington National Airport and

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Andrews Air Force Base these of course

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led the security concerns because the

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UFOs ignored restricted areas such as

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the White House and flew right over and

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this made the authorities pretty nervous

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although he didn't exactly act like it

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in public and how many how many times

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did they appear over the the area over

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the DC area there were a number of

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objects and so I don't know I think they

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appeared on one night over Washington

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area and then they appeared over another

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airport and they appeared back to

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Washington but there was another night

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that some appeared also the first ones

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were July 19 mmm now where there are

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visual sightings as well as the radar

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reports yes there were and I think one

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pilot reported that an object follow

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this plane I think there are several

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visual sightings and some of the pilots

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who

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don't really want to report UFOs did

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that night and one followed a pilot and

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what were what were their descriptions

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of the objects as I remember I think

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they were just objects I don't think

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anybody saw like a fuselage or anything

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like that on I had the impression they

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were maybe orange but I don't remember

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yes I know and about what time it was

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this was just like after after sunset

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after dusk

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it was 11:40 apparently oh my goodness

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our first one and how long were where

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they especially visible but how long

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were they I guess visible as well as

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being picked up on radar I think it

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lasted for some time they showed on

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radar three different facilities and

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under Andrews radio radio beacon radio

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now uh I've said there's one of the the

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best them UFO documentaries and you

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would probably agree was the UFO movie

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that was made in 1956 and that has a

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whole sequence of course without chopped

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and repelled and all uh discussing this

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and re-enacting the events that went on

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so okay that was the you pretty much

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described the the first night what was

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the attitude of the I mean did the

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government did they consults that dr.

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Hynek obviously wasn't around at that

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point I don't think but did they consult

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the experts to see what these objects

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might have been well one thing I'd like

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to note about that was is that it took

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them you'd expect them to be real

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concerned about that and to get the Jets

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up and

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took them quite a while before they got

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before they had to jets come up like it

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was almost morning and it was very

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surprising that they didn't get them up

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right after it happened do you think

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they might have known about this in

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advance what made me wonder because I

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thought they should start investigating

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pretty fast than they didn't so it took

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a while for the the cover-up kind of do

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to start taking hold

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yeah I think they saw him at around

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11:30 and finally around daybreak two

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fighter jets jets arrived from Newcastle

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Air Force Base and by then the UFOs were

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gone that could cover up to me

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sacredness they weren't to Russians yeah

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yeah yeah I guess what we okay so that

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was the first night now then they did

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return a you say a week a week later was

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it around the same time I mean why are

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we talking about a Friday or Saturday

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night July 26th and this was apparently

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at 8:15 which was earlier or earlier

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uh-huh and and was this a visual as well

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as a radar I think so

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they had it on the radar screens and

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some of the pilots and ground people

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confirmed the sightings now they did say

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I think it at one point or at least in

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the in the the movie I don't know how

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long after the actual incident this was

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they did say that the objects were

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nothing more than what were they had

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temperature inversions that's what they

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said and that seemed kind of weird

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because like in Ohio right here we've

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had temperature inversion was we had one

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that lasted several days and there was

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this horrible smell all over over the

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Central Ohio but nobody saw anything

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weird in the sky

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I know I was and I was just going to say

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is it possible that a temperature

273
00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:26,660
inversion could out chase a plane or go

274
00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:29,690
faster than a plane I mean wouldn't they

275
00:15:36,330 --> 00:15:33,530
pretty much be on the on the radar scope

276
00:15:38,470 --> 00:15:36,340
at one point and stay there and not be

277
00:15:40,840 --> 00:15:38,480
well they probably wouldn't be

278
00:15:43,510 --> 00:15:40,850
noticeable if you were a pilot up in the

279
00:15:44,980 --> 00:15:43,520
air right I mean I don't think you can

280
00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:44,990
combine the two to go I don't know I've

281
00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:46,850
never I've never had the privilege of

282
00:15:53,020 --> 00:15:48,290
seeing a temperature inversion that I

283
00:15:56,740 --> 00:15:53,030
know of Meli atmospheric science there's

284
00:16:01,000 --> 00:15:56,750
James McDonald who is a PhD and he

285
00:16:04,390 --> 00:16:01,010
rejected this Turkish third theory : but

286
00:16:07,350 --> 00:16:04,400
I would I think they were saying the

287
00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:07,360
temperature inversions were reflecting

288
00:16:12,460 --> 00:16:09,890
traffic maybe I mean that's the only

289
00:16:14,530 --> 00:16:12,470
hearing capsule yeah I'll do that

290
00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:14,540
and traffic when we following airplanes

291
00:16:20,170 --> 00:16:17,290
and things so didn't seem quite right

292
00:16:23,380 --> 00:16:20,180
well I know there's a rather famous a

293
00:16:24,970 --> 00:16:23,390
photograph of the the Capitol the

294
00:16:29,740 --> 00:16:24,980
building of the White House which shows

295
00:16:33,010 --> 00:16:29,750
a flotilla that's a good way of objects

296
00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:33,020
of passing by in the sky but I guess

297
00:16:37,630 --> 00:16:34,730
some people believe that that's a

298
00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:37,640
reflection of the lights from down on

299
00:16:41,980 --> 00:16:39,170
the ground which it may be I don't know

300
00:16:42,810 --> 00:16:41,990
I Rick have you do you know about that

301
00:16:45,430 --> 00:16:42,820
photograph

302
00:16:47,470 --> 00:16:45,440
yeah that's best photos been around for

303
00:16:49,570 --> 00:16:47,480
a long time and I think it yes pretty

304
00:16:50,980 --> 00:16:49,580
much it was some sort of it was taken

305
00:16:53,500 --> 00:16:50,990
through a window or something there was

306
00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:53,510
some sort of interior lights reflected

307
00:16:58,510 --> 00:16:56,090
or something of that sort yeah and and

308
00:17:02,470 --> 00:16:58,520
it some people claimed he was taken on

309
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:02,480
either July 20th of July 26 252 but I

310
00:17:07,360 --> 00:17:04,970
think it was actually taken at a much

311
00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:07,370
later date and you know people try to

312
00:17:12,490 --> 00:17:09,770
pass it off as being from you know that

313
00:17:16,060 --> 00:17:12,500
particular incident yes but we know were

314
00:17:18,580 --> 00:17:16,070
a lot of it yeah you know recently there

315
00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:18,590
was a mysterious red light that was

316
00:17:23,950 --> 00:17:20,930
associated with the White House that's

317
00:17:25,870 --> 00:17:23,960
been seen blinking in one of the back

318
00:17:29,140 --> 00:17:25,880
windows or something so perhaps one of

319
00:17:33,419 --> 00:17:29,150
those pesky little orbs had got in there

320
00:17:38,710 --> 00:17:35,590
b-but there have been there had been

321
00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:38,720
visual sightings of UFOs over Washington

322
00:17:43,090 --> 00:17:41,690
that year I mean that started as early

323
00:17:47,830 --> 00:17:43,100
I think the reports were starting to

324
00:17:49,840 --> 00:17:47,840
come in around in May so I mean this and

325
00:17:53,950 --> 00:17:49,850
you know considering you're talking

326
00:17:56,169 --> 00:17:53,960
about how slow the reaction was to get

327
00:17:58,510 --> 00:17:56,179
the Jets out you know it seems funny

328
00:18:01,060 --> 00:17:58,520
that everyone seemed to act like that

329
00:18:03,220 --> 00:18:01,070
they were totally unprepared when these

330
00:18:06,430 --> 00:18:03,230
crafts started really flying over

331
00:18:08,409 --> 00:18:06,440
restricted airspace or wouldn't take

332
00:18:11,549 --> 00:18:08,419
them that long to get the Jets up you

333
00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:11,559
know it's a restricted airspace well

334
00:18:17,039 --> 00:18:13,970
part of the problem part of the problem

335
00:18:19,570 --> 00:18:17,049
was that Andrews was having its runways

336
00:18:22,270 --> 00:18:19,580
resurfaced at the time and as Irena

337
00:18:25,750 --> 00:18:22,280
pointed out they did they did come from

338
00:18:28,690 --> 00:18:25,760
New Castle Delaware so there was a

339
00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:28,700
certain amount of lag time involved in

340
00:18:32,799 --> 00:18:30,890
that and I think you know what just

341
00:18:35,230 --> 00:18:32,809
happened was see the air traffic

342
00:18:38,260 --> 00:18:35,240
controllers and you know we're just kind

343
00:18:40,659 --> 00:18:38,270
of flabbergasted by these images on the

344
00:18:44,020 --> 00:18:40,669
radar screens and Andrews at at national

345
00:18:46,060 --> 00:18:44,030
and I think that maybe part of the

346
00:18:48,250 --> 00:18:46,070
problem was you know who has the

347
00:18:50,470 --> 00:18:48,260
authority to you know to call for a

348
00:18:53,409 --> 00:18:50,480
scramble so that may be part of it too

349
00:18:56,950 --> 00:18:53,419
so I think that it's just a combination

350
00:19:00,789 --> 00:18:56,960
of things and as Tim pointed out Tim

351
00:19:04,150 --> 00:19:00,799
asked that there were indeed a number of

352
00:19:06,190 --> 00:19:04,160
other pilots who were in the DC area at

353
00:19:08,169 --> 00:19:06,200
the time near Washington and you know

354
00:19:11,020 --> 00:19:08,179
and holding traffic patterns or whatever

355
00:19:13,990 --> 00:19:11,030
who actually did spot the the lysis did

356
00:19:16,750 --> 00:19:14,000
I think was Air Force Lieutenant William

357
00:19:20,530 --> 00:19:16,760
Paterson and that was kind of dramatized

358
00:19:23,260 --> 00:19:20,540
overly in that 56 you know documentary

359
00:19:26,590 --> 00:19:23,270
UFO and actually one of the trivia

360
00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:26,600
questions is Harry Morgan who played on

361
00:19:32,049 --> 00:19:29,210
Nash captain Potter actually did the

362
00:19:36,070 --> 00:19:32,059
voice of the Patterson in the in the

363
00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:36,080
movie well now there's also an

364
00:19:42,700 --> 00:19:41,090
interesting incident that took place we

365
00:19:45,049 --> 00:19:42,710
published a book some years ago by

366
00:19:50,060 --> 00:19:45,059
Captain Alvin

367
00:19:52,369 --> 00:19:50,070
more now he lived in the outskirts of DC

368
00:19:55,610 --> 00:19:52,379
you know in Virginia somewhere and he

369
00:19:58,039 --> 00:19:55,620
claims that there that the one of the

370
00:20:01,159 --> 00:19:58,049
objects was actually shot at and that

371
00:20:04,789 --> 00:20:01,169
fragments from the craft fell in his

372
00:20:07,580 --> 00:20:04,799
backyard well he was at the mill he was

373
00:20:10,759 --> 00:20:07,590
in the the I think the CIA at the the

374
00:20:13,820 --> 00:20:10,769
time he took the fragments and for

375
00:20:18,889 --> 00:20:13,830
security purposes and for safekeeping he

376
00:20:22,399 --> 00:20:18,899
put them in a secure safe either in his

377
00:20:24,320 --> 00:20:22,409
home or in his office but later a few

378
00:20:28,389 --> 00:20:24,330
days later when he went to retrieve them

379
00:20:31,430 --> 00:20:28,399
they were gone and he claims that nobody

380
00:20:35,060 --> 00:20:31,440
had the combination to the safe and it

381
00:20:38,109 --> 00:20:35,070
doesn't look like it was you know like a

382
00:20:41,119 --> 00:20:38,119
cracked in the sense you know a

383
00:20:43,999 --> 00:20:41,129
safecracker getting into the into the

384
00:20:48,739 --> 00:20:44,009
fall so that's a kind of a mysterious

385
00:20:52,789 --> 00:20:48,749
side bar on this incident but there have

386
00:20:56,119 --> 00:20:52,799
if you point out that Tim quite a few

387
00:20:58,609 --> 00:20:56,129
sightings over Washington DC over the

388
00:21:02,359 --> 00:20:58,619
years I I wouldn't say it's a great

389
00:21:07,039 --> 00:21:02,369
window area but I remember I interviewed

390
00:21:09,619 --> 00:21:07,049
a a lady wrote it up for Saga magazine

391
00:21:11,210 --> 00:21:09,629
the UFO base that was 40 miles from the

392
00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:11,220
White House she had all kinds of

393
00:21:18,350 --> 00:21:14,090
incredible you know experiences

394
00:21:22,159 --> 00:21:18,360
associated with the DC area and then

395
00:21:25,519 --> 00:21:22,169
remember we have a tape an interview

396
00:21:28,279 --> 00:21:25,529
that I did that's posted up on the mr.

397
00:21:31,820 --> 00:21:28,289
UFO secret files on YouTube with the

398
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:31,830
Paul Dickey and Paul Dickey was a manga

399
00:21:41,570 --> 00:21:37,970
I think eight other government employees

400
00:21:44,269 --> 00:21:41,580
who were watching the the flight of a

401
00:21:46,279 --> 00:21:44,279
couple of objects from their office

402
00:21:49,220 --> 00:21:46,289
window I don't think it was inside the

403
00:21:52,519 --> 00:21:49,230
Pentagon but you know we're nearby there

404
00:21:55,279 --> 00:21:52,529
in Capitol Hill so there have been other

405
00:21:57,259 --> 00:21:55,289
sightings you know it's not you say

406
00:21:58,970 --> 00:21:57,269
restricted area but I guess as far as

407
00:22:02,870 --> 00:21:58,980
UFOs ago

408
00:22:06,470 --> 00:22:02,880
it's not quite that restricted for our

409
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:06,480
space brothers in thing if they want to

410
00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:11,330
appear in the the sky there but now 1952

411
00:22:18,230 --> 00:22:15,450
arena was the certainly the height

412
00:22:20,060 --> 00:22:18,240
wasn't that the the most UFO activity of

413
00:22:24,140 --> 00:22:20,070
any a year or certainly up to that point

414
00:22:27,130 --> 00:22:24,150
but maybe even since then 1952 I was

415
00:22:31,430 --> 00:22:27,140
thinking there was more several days in

416
00:22:34,730 --> 00:22:31,440
1973 so I'm not sure there was a lot of

417
00:22:36,350 --> 00:22:34,740
activity around that time to and and

418
00:22:38,930 --> 00:22:36,360
what were some of the other reports that

419
00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:38,940
came in around though the the the 50s

420
00:22:44,720 --> 00:22:42,650
that you discuss in your in your work

421
00:22:47,360 --> 00:22:44,730
well another thing I wanted to mention

422
00:22:54,080 --> 00:22:47,370
about that one was that I interviewed

423
00:22:57,860 --> 00:22:54,090
somebody whose father-in-law was a pilot

424
00:23:01,400 --> 00:22:57,870
in her first husband's father was a

425
00:23:09,500 --> 00:23:01,410
pilot who was scrambled to chase see

426
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:09,510
Washington UFOs and he she thought he

427
00:23:16,340 --> 00:23:11,610
was a second one behind the leaked lead

428
00:23:19,070 --> 00:23:16,350
pilot and she recalled they talked to

429
00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:19,080
the family from time to time and he was

430
00:23:23,810 --> 00:23:20,730
upset because the government hadn't

431
00:23:24,980 --> 00:23:23,820
briefed him and the other pilots and

432
00:23:29,740 --> 00:23:24,990
they thought they were going after

433
00:23:33,830 --> 00:23:29,750
Soviet planes invading the US airspace

434
00:23:36,590 --> 00:23:33,840
when he when they saw these um euros

435
00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:36,600
over Washington I guess what he died the

436
00:23:41,420 --> 00:23:39,210
government came in went very small ooh

437
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:41,430
all right when you dinner up to here

438
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:42,810
because we're it's time for our bottom

439
00:23:48,029 --> 00:23:44,250
of the hour break when we come back

440
00:23:54,049 --> 00:23:48,039
we'll continue with more on exploring

441
00:23:56,849 --> 00:23:54,059
are now that to explore in the bazaar

442
00:23:59,599 --> 00:23:56,859
with two of the most under fire

443
00:24:06,210 --> 00:23:59,609
researchers with harriel your host

444
00:24:08,369 --> 00:24:06,220
Timothy Becky Lee panting Swartz and

445
00:24:11,519 --> 00:24:08,379
welcome back to exploring bizarre tim

446
00:24:14,820 --> 00:24:11,529
schwartz tonight we are talking with dr.

447
00:24:18,719 --> 00:24:14,830
irina scott and mr. Rick hilberg about

448
00:24:22,879 --> 00:24:18,729
the history of UFOs and I think I think

449
00:24:28,469 --> 00:24:22,889
Tim we we left off with dr. Scott

450
00:24:31,289 --> 00:24:28,479
describing a pilots family who though

451
00:24:33,989 --> 00:24:31,299
pilot had been volved with the the the

452
00:24:36,269 --> 00:24:33,999
Washington UFO case and you know dr.

453
00:24:37,950 --> 00:24:36,279
Scott II would like to continue or

454
00:24:40,379 --> 00:24:37,960
thought before you were so rudely

455
00:24:46,249 --> 00:24:40,389
interrupted by our bottom of the hour

456
00:24:51,799 --> 00:24:46,259
break uh okay

457
00:24:55,739 --> 00:24:51,809
this was somebody I interviewed and her

458
00:25:01,649 --> 00:24:55,749
father-in-law from her first husband was

459
00:25:03,899 --> 00:25:01,659
a colonel lieutenant colonel who was one

460
00:25:05,729 --> 00:25:03,909
of the who he told her was one of the

461
00:25:08,519 --> 00:25:05,739
pilots that chased the Washington and

462
00:25:11,009 --> 00:25:08,529
UFOs and she also thought he'd worked

463
00:25:15,570 --> 00:25:11,019
for Project Blue Book she thought he was

464
00:25:17,339 --> 00:25:15,580
a second behind a lead pilot and she

465
00:25:20,700 --> 00:25:17,349
said that when he talked to his family

466
00:25:23,580 --> 00:25:20,710
he had been upset because the government

467
00:25:26,129 --> 00:25:23,590
hadn't briefed him and his fellow pilots

468
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:26,139
about UFOs and the pilots thought they

469
00:25:33,690 --> 00:25:28,690
were going after Soviet planes invading

470
00:25:42,899 --> 00:25:33,700
us US airspace and then what he died I

471
00:25:45,719 --> 00:25:42,909
guess the CIA came in and cordon off his

472
00:25:48,629 --> 00:25:45,729
house and look through his old files he

473
00:25:53,810 --> 00:25:48,639
had written some papers to I don't

474
00:25:57,779 --> 00:25:53,820
remember right now about UFOs in public

475
00:25:58,950 --> 00:25:57,789
when I once again though we see this you

476
00:26:01,290 --> 00:25:58,960
know the

477
00:26:02,940 --> 00:26:01,300
the government the military and you know

478
00:26:06,330 --> 00:26:02,950
the intelligence services all denied

479
00:26:08,910 --> 00:26:06,340
that they have any interest in UFOs yet

480
00:26:12,650 --> 00:26:08,920
time and time again we see just these

481
00:26:16,890 --> 00:26:12,660
types of cases where they swoop in and

482
00:26:18,540 --> 00:26:16,900
try to grab paperwork that you know

483
00:26:22,290 --> 00:26:18,550
maybe witnesses especially military

484
00:26:24,420 --> 00:26:22,300
witnesses have put together or you know

485
00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:24,430
told family members to you know shut the

486
00:26:32,400 --> 00:26:28,930
hell up so you know it's I suppose it's

487
00:26:35,940 --> 00:26:32,410
to the public now they say Oh up you

488
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:35,950
know UFOs know no interest no threat to

489
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:38,730
security but then on the other side

490
00:26:44,220 --> 00:26:40,930
they're very very interested

491
00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:44,230
well there were awful quite a number of

492
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:47,410
cases I think around that the early

493
00:26:52,500 --> 00:26:50,770
1950s involving pilots I think Rick

494
00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:52,510
weren't you saying it during the break

495
00:26:57,050 --> 00:26:55,330
that you knew about quite a number of

496
00:26:59,790 --> 00:26:57,060
them and you pointed out that we had a

497
00:27:02,310 --> 00:26:59,800
one of the early pilots to speak at a

498
00:27:06,150 --> 00:27:02,320
UFO conference that I co-sponsored with

499
00:27:08,910 --> 00:27:06,160
Jim Mosely in Miami many many years ago

500
00:27:12,390 --> 00:27:08,920
what year was that anyway I was banking

501
00:27:14,730 --> 00:27:12,400
92 way back then but this yeah the

502
00:27:16,250 --> 00:27:14,740
fellows name was William Dean Ashe and

503
00:27:20,370 --> 00:27:16,260
this is a famous Nash and Fortenberry

504
00:27:23,340 --> 00:27:20,380
incident this happened on July 14th they

505
00:27:26,010 --> 00:27:23,350
were flying a DC 4 airliner on they were

506
00:27:27,780 --> 00:27:26,020
porch approaching Norfolk Virginia they

507
00:27:30,300 --> 00:27:27,790
were headed curiously enough to Miami

508
00:27:32,550 --> 00:27:30,310
and when they did both the pilot and

509
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:32,560
co-pilot noticed the six bright objects

510
00:27:38,820 --> 00:27:36,490
that were moving towards the plane they

511
00:27:40,770 --> 00:27:38,830
said that their shape was basically

512
00:27:42,990 --> 00:27:40,780
circular and they were flying in line

513
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:43,000
and they both thought that they were

514
00:27:48,780 --> 00:27:45,250
about a hundred feet in diameter well

515
00:27:50,700 --> 00:27:48,790
you know they were you know still in the

516
00:27:53,910 --> 00:27:50,710
air the the objects flew but you know

517
00:27:56,490 --> 00:27:53,920
like directly underneath the plane and

518
00:27:59,670 --> 00:27:56,500
they the pilot and co-pilot Nash before

519
00:28:02,310 --> 00:27:59,680
Barry saw him flip on edge in unison and

520
00:28:04,350 --> 00:28:02,320
then they were joined by two more

521
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:04,360
similar objects that streaked in from

522
00:28:09,660 --> 00:28:07,450
the from the east and then all eight of

523
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:09,670
them you know sped away and they started

524
00:28:12,010 --> 00:28:11,650
blinking out in the sequential order and

525
00:28:16,120 --> 00:28:12,020
they were

526
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:16,130
on and I think the impression I get from

527
00:28:23,470 --> 00:28:20,930
from listening to Nash was that you know

528
00:28:24,610 --> 00:28:23,480
the well it was reported in the press

529
00:28:28,180 --> 00:28:24,620
and everything

530
00:28:29,890 --> 00:28:28,190
the airline I could get what I think I

531
00:28:32,950 --> 00:28:29,900
don't know if they were America I think

532
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:32,960
American Airlines yeah yeah and I think

533
00:28:36,970 --> 00:28:35,090
the company puts some pressure on them

534
00:28:39,310 --> 00:28:36,980
you know not to really talk about this

535
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:39,320
too much yet and that seems to be the

536
00:28:44,410 --> 00:28:42,410
key to the whole you know why don't I

537
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:44,420
'let's airline pilots report these will

538
00:28:48,930 --> 00:28:47,090
they do but the airline put puts

539
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:48,940
pressure on them not to make it public

540
00:28:54,940 --> 00:28:52,010
there how no how about you must have

541
00:28:57,130 --> 00:28:54,950
heard on the the news that the you know

542
00:29:00,010 --> 00:28:57,140
the Phoenix at lights there was a report

543
00:29:02,170 --> 00:29:00,020
for a long time that a pilot had seen it

544
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:02,180
he was coming in to land it turned out

545
00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:05,930
it was Kurt Russell the the actor mmm I

546
00:29:10,060 --> 00:29:08,810
heard about oh yeah yeah yeah it I heard

547
00:29:14,380 --> 00:29:10,070
the actual interview that he did with

548
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:14,390
some British radio station you know I

549
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:15,890
mean he happened to mention it in

550
00:29:22,030 --> 00:29:19,010
passing it wasn't a UFO or a paranormal

551
00:29:23,650 --> 00:29:22,040
show but he yeah he said he was the the

552
00:29:26,610 --> 00:29:23,660
pilot was coming in and here is this

553
00:29:32,170 --> 00:29:26,620
thing you know above him and it was

554
00:29:34,540 --> 00:29:32,180
gigantic and it indeed it was but they

555
00:29:36,940 --> 00:29:34,550
were there were quite a few up now I'm

556
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:36,950
trying to remember a Rick I remember

557
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:39,530
there's a cover of Ray Palmer's flying

558
00:29:43,390 --> 00:29:41,450
saucers magazine when it was a digest

559
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:43,400
and there were two part there were two

560
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:45,770
pilots on the cover and I think a

561
00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:48,010
stewardess does that ring a bell

562
00:29:57,190 --> 00:29:52,370
yes yes now that was that was back in 47

563
00:30:00,340 --> 00:29:57,200
that was oh gosh William B Smith was the

564
00:30:02,740 --> 00:30:00,350
pilot I can't forget that the co-pilot

565
00:30:07,060 --> 00:30:02,750
this was right after the Kenneth Arnold

566
00:30:08,830 --> 00:30:07,070
sighting on June 24th um yeah

567
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:08,840
Smith they were taking off from

568
00:30:14,500 --> 00:30:11,930
somewhere in the Midwest and they they

569
00:30:16,360 --> 00:30:14,510
saw this large disc-shaped object you

570
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:16,370
know in the in the air they're flying

571
00:30:21,970 --> 00:30:19,130
towards it and they were they were

572
00:30:24,370 --> 00:30:21,980
showing the photograph with like a disc

573
00:30:25,049 --> 00:30:24,380
in hand in the studio the stewardess was

574
00:30:26,940 --> 00:30:25,059
there and the

575
00:30:28,860 --> 00:30:26,950
they were just you know showing it

576
00:30:31,289 --> 00:30:28,870
pointing to the disk that's what they

577
00:30:33,749 --> 00:30:31,299
saw and I guess maybe even a passenger

578
00:30:35,820 --> 00:30:33,759
to Sun I can't believe so yes yes I

579
00:30:37,950 --> 00:30:35,830
believe so yeah I think it was in July I

580
00:30:41,330 --> 00:30:37,960
think it was in July maybe early July

581
00:30:43,350 --> 00:30:41,340
July 2nd or something like that a 47

582
00:30:45,119 --> 00:30:43,360
well I remember that they were there

583
00:30:49,350 --> 00:30:45,129
were quite a few pilot reports around

584
00:30:52,169 --> 00:30:49,360
that time now you know what has also

585
00:30:55,169 --> 00:30:52,179
intrigued me and dr. scribed did you

586
00:30:56,970 --> 00:30:55,179
investigate any of the e/m cases you

587
00:31:04,350 --> 00:30:56,980
know where the automobiles and almost

588
00:31:06,419 --> 00:31:04,360
were stalled uh such as um compasses or

589
00:31:08,909 --> 00:31:06,429
what well if there were automobile

590
00:31:12,389 --> 00:31:08,919
engines remember told me now yeah yeah

591
00:31:17,399 --> 00:31:12,399
this was um I think it was a level one

592
00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:17,409
case level in Diaz and on November the

593
00:31:23,999 --> 00:31:21,610
3rd 1957 they authorities received

594
00:31:30,210 --> 00:31:24,009
reports of one or several large

595
00:31:34,409 --> 00:31:30,220
UFOs in level in Texas and people in the

596
00:31:38,159 --> 00:31:34,419
area so ready sir blue screen objects

597
00:31:40,369 --> 00:31:38,169
they stopped by roadways and they would

598
00:31:43,159 --> 00:31:40,379
suddenly be part but they caused

599
00:31:46,369 --> 00:31:43,169
electromagnetic effects on vehicles and

600
00:31:49,019 --> 00:31:46,379
cars would not function properly

601
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:49,029
sometimes the engine I had like tonight

602
00:31:56,730 --> 00:31:51,970
turned off or the engine can be

603
00:31:59,940 --> 00:31:56,740
restarted and I remember several um

604
00:32:01,560 --> 00:31:59,950
one of them was pulsing and it seemed

605
00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:01,570
like every time it would pulse li

606
00:32:04,919 --> 00:32:03,610
headlights of a car went off or

607
00:32:09,269 --> 00:32:04,929
something and there were just a number

608
00:32:14,249 --> 00:32:09,279
of reports in that same area of Texas

609
00:32:17,190 --> 00:32:14,259
and it included a sheriff and various

610
00:32:20,129 --> 00:32:17,200
other people right I think the Mexico

611
00:32:25,019 --> 00:32:20,139
two had some cases along that line just

612
00:32:28,950 --> 00:32:25,029
around that period as as well but now it

613
00:32:31,169 --> 00:32:28,960
didn't examine the the engines of the

614
00:32:34,580 --> 00:32:31,179
car the vehicles themselves later on and

615
00:32:37,500 --> 00:32:34,590
and they found that they had been

616
00:32:40,650 --> 00:32:37,510
magnetized or demagnetized

617
00:32:43,620 --> 00:32:40,660
oh I didn't know that yeah I you know I

618
00:32:46,020 --> 00:32:43,630
again that's a little bit before I mean

619
00:32:48,150 --> 00:32:46,030
I've read up on this but 57 well that's

620
00:32:49,710 --> 00:32:48,160
when I had my first UFO sighting and and

621
00:32:53,730 --> 00:32:49,720
so I probably was starting to read up on

622
00:32:55,350 --> 00:32:53,740
some of these you know cases did do you

623
00:32:59,910 --> 00:32:55,360
remember any details on those little

624
00:33:02,640 --> 00:32:59,920
Rick's in those early mm cases well I

625
00:33:05,250 --> 00:33:02,650
know they try to they try to explain

626
00:33:06,930 --> 00:33:05,260
them away as being like wet ignitions or

627
00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:06,940
something and there's no rain in the

628
00:33:13,230 --> 00:33:09,490
area at the time and stuff like that but

629
00:33:15,150 --> 00:33:13,240
yes I have heard maybe it wasn't with

630
00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:15,160
levelin but there were a number of

631
00:33:21,150 --> 00:33:16,690
instances yes where there are some

632
00:33:23,730 --> 00:33:21,160
magnetic anomalies found like on the the

633
00:33:25,860 --> 00:33:23,740
the car hoods or maybe even under the

634
00:33:28,380 --> 00:33:25,870
underneath the hoods or whatever yeah

635
00:33:30,480 --> 00:33:28,390
there were some magnetic anomalies found

636
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:30,490
in some of these cases over the years I

637
00:33:36,810 --> 00:33:34,930
think more than one and what what

638
00:33:41,490 --> 00:33:36,820
exactly would that would that prove do

639
00:33:43,350 --> 00:33:41,500
you think well it really it proves it

640
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:43,360
that some sort of incident took place

641
00:33:50,450 --> 00:33:46,450
you'd have to have a very strong you

642
00:33:54,030 --> 00:33:50,460
know magnetic field of some particular

643
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:54,040
power you know to to to leave some sort

644
00:33:58,830 --> 00:33:55,330
of a footprint like that behind

645
00:34:01,220 --> 00:33:58,840
innocence races so it probably shows

646
00:34:04,740 --> 00:34:01,230
that it's it's more than just you know

647
00:34:07,230 --> 00:34:04,750
somebody out driving and their car

648
00:34:08,940 --> 00:34:07,240
stalling for you know maybe they flooded

649
00:34:10,770 --> 00:34:08,950
the engine or this or that or the other

650
00:34:12,540 --> 00:34:10,780
thing or they needed a tune-up or

651
00:34:14,340 --> 00:34:12,550
whatever and it was just their

652
00:34:16,050 --> 00:34:14,350
imagination but it proves that you know

653
00:34:18,330 --> 00:34:16,060
something anomalous actually did happen

654
00:34:22,619 --> 00:34:18,340
well it sounds like they got a tune up

655
00:34:24,780 --> 00:34:22,629
alright yeah yeah you know I think a pet

656
00:34:26,730 --> 00:34:24,790
boys yeah yeah whatever right you know

657
00:34:29,700 --> 00:34:26,740
III think one of the interesting things

658
00:34:31,500 --> 00:34:29,710
about these stalled car cases is that a

659
00:34:34,740 --> 00:34:31,510
lot of times the witnesses would report

660
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:34,750
that the car would just simply just be

661
00:34:40,889 --> 00:34:37,810
dead when the you know the UFO would

662
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:40,899
appear but then as soon as UFO would

663
00:34:45,419 --> 00:34:43,450
disappear the car would start itself up

664
00:34:49,020 --> 00:34:45,429
again almost just like it had been

665
00:34:51,510 --> 00:34:49,030
frozen for a brief amount of time and

666
00:34:53,250 --> 00:34:51,520
then it would just

667
00:34:55,880 --> 00:34:53,260
once it was freed from whatever field

668
00:34:59,670 --> 00:34:55,890
that was affecting it it would

669
00:35:04,860 --> 00:34:59,680
reactivate so station there was one

670
00:35:09,180 --> 00:35:04,870
instance the name was James Stokes and

671
00:35:14,100 --> 00:35:09,190
he was by white sands and he was an

672
00:35:18,710 --> 00:35:14,110
engineer and he reported that his he was

673
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:18,720
driving toward El Paso near Oreo Grande

674
00:35:25,890 --> 00:35:23,050
and his engine failed and he coasted to

675
00:35:30,720 --> 00:35:25,900
a halt he noticed the other cars ahead

676
00:35:33,780 --> 00:35:30,730
of him also were stopped he saw a large

677
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:33,790
white egg-shaped object moving in and

678
00:35:40,350 --> 00:35:37,330
out of the clouds that douve a few miles

679
00:35:43,230 --> 00:35:40,360
ahead after it passes the closest he

680
00:35:49,500 --> 00:35:43,240
felt a heat wave that made his skin

681
00:35:51,840 --> 00:35:49,510
tingle at anyway rent Energy's car you

682
00:35:54,630 --> 00:35:51,850
checked the engine and it worked but the

683
00:35:57,510 --> 00:35:54,640
battery was steaming so that's kind of

684
00:36:02,430 --> 00:35:57,520
an interesting that was in let me see I

685
00:36:05,430 --> 00:36:02,440
think that was in 1957 - now would you

686
00:36:08,250 --> 00:36:05,440
say I mean doesn't it seem that there

687
00:36:11,940 --> 00:36:08,260
were a lot more what we would call maybe

688
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:11,950
physical evidence cases in those days

689
00:36:20,190 --> 00:36:16,170
than today of course we do have the oh

690
00:36:24,930 --> 00:36:20,200
the the chips the implants perhaps if

691
00:36:26,670 --> 00:36:24,940
they are legitimate but it seems like

692
00:36:33,950 --> 00:36:26,680
there was a little bit more in the way

693
00:36:41,670 --> 00:36:36,270
remember we're claiming all sorts of

694
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:41,680
things like that yes well it at what

695
00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:44,530
point did that I mean is it do you think

696
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:47,170
it's because of the the pressure that

697
00:36:51,330 --> 00:36:49,090
the government put on witnesses that a

698
00:36:53,970 --> 00:36:51,340
lot of what might have been these

699
00:36:56,700 --> 00:36:53,980
substantial sightings just we're not

700
00:37:01,920 --> 00:36:56,710
reported after a particular period of

701
00:37:04,260 --> 00:37:01,930
time well I did a survey once around my

702
00:37:05,380 --> 00:37:04,270
neighborhood a person I did a survey

703
00:37:09,470 --> 00:37:05,390
actually put

704
00:37:11,390 --> 00:37:09,480
scientific journal two of these are

705
00:37:14,839 --> 00:37:11,400
people I knew and I surveyed them and

706
00:37:16,370 --> 00:37:14,849
asked them they had a UFO sighting and a

707
00:37:19,670 --> 00:37:16,380
lot of them seem to have pretty good

708
00:37:22,730 --> 00:37:19,680
sightings but just almost nobody

709
00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:22,740
reported them and I knew the people so I

710
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:24,930
knew they were honest I didn't just go

711
00:37:30,220 --> 00:37:27,690
random I went to people I knew because

712
00:37:35,589 --> 00:37:30,230
this be a different type of survey them

713
00:37:38,750 --> 00:37:35,599
randomly surveying people but people I

714
00:37:44,450 --> 00:37:38,760
did in the 1980s and they surveyed and

715
00:37:46,790 --> 00:37:44,460
recruited and then and well okay well so

716
00:37:50,630 --> 00:37:46,800
they people have been keeping these

717
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:50,640
reports to themselves for pretty much I

718
00:37:55,010 --> 00:37:53,010
guess the public at large well you could

719
00:37:57,500 --> 00:37:55,020
say there's actually nobody to report

720
00:38:02,270 --> 00:37:57,510
them to now we do know that the mutual

721
00:38:05,089 --> 00:38:02,280
UFO network and Peter Davenport's a UFO

722
00:38:08,720 --> 00:38:05,099
reports center they still get a large

723
00:38:10,250 --> 00:38:08,730
number of sightings I mean but the

724
00:38:12,710 --> 00:38:10,260
sightings that come and go

725
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:12,720
I mean we're interested here mainly in

726
00:38:18,020 --> 00:38:15,690
things of some you know substance where

727
00:38:20,569 --> 00:38:18,030
we could actually point to a case and

728
00:38:24,349 --> 00:38:20,579
say looked as a burn mark on the ground

729
00:38:26,720 --> 00:38:24,359
or installed an automobile or you know a

730
00:38:30,349 --> 00:38:26,730
but well I remember one case in

731
00:38:32,960 --> 00:38:30,359
Australia where apparently a longest

732
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:32,970
section of highway cars were actually

733
00:38:38,660 --> 00:38:36,210
being were actually driven off the road

734
00:38:41,359 --> 00:38:38,670
because there was some sort of magnetic

735
00:38:44,809 --> 00:38:41,369
pull in this one particular you know

736
00:38:48,079 --> 00:38:44,819
instance but did you it dr. Scott did

737
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:48,089
you an investigator look into any of the

738
00:39:01,720 --> 00:38:52,410
early reports of humanoid beings or

739
00:39:05,240 --> 00:39:01,730
contact encounters uh yes some of them I

740
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:05,250
think a pro investigated quite a bit and

741
00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:11,010
had a book about the beings and one of

742
00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:17,010
the events I investigated was um it took

743
00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:18,810
a part in Missouri and I think it was in

744
00:39:23,120 --> 00:39:19,050
the

745
00:39:27,560 --> 00:39:23,130
1980s I'm not sure but anyway people

746
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:27,570
would see these the observers will sell

747
00:39:34,430 --> 00:39:31,650
these lights and some people that just

748
00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:34,440
saw lights scurrying around and other

749
00:39:40,340 --> 00:39:36,690
people another person watching the same

750
00:39:41,960 --> 00:39:40,350
scene saw beings and these were all

751
00:39:43,340 --> 00:39:41,970
kinds of beings that were walking around

752
00:39:46,250 --> 00:39:43,350
and everything else with people were

753
00:39:49,550 --> 00:39:46,260
terrified but they couldn't figure out

754
00:39:52,730 --> 00:39:49,560
and it seemed like it they would appear

755
00:39:55,190 --> 00:39:52,740
as orbs to some and being as other and

756
00:40:00,140 --> 00:39:55,200
they were all kinds of things like tall

757
00:40:03,230 --> 00:40:00,150
Nordics or short squatty ones or the

758
00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:03,240
Michelin Man yeah and that's one of my

759
00:40:08,270 --> 00:40:05,610
favorites it looks like it but it does

760
00:40:10,090 --> 00:40:08,280
leave the the dough boy or something

761
00:40:12,860 --> 00:40:10,100
like that uh-huh

762
00:40:16,550 --> 00:40:12,870
well Rick you you collect I know you you

763
00:40:18,260 --> 00:40:16,560
printed over the years any number of I I

764
00:40:21,020 --> 00:40:18,270
call them creature sightings but heaven

765
00:40:24,890 --> 00:40:21,030
forbid they probably refer they probably

766
00:40:27,010 --> 00:40:24,900
refer to us as creatures yeah that's

767
00:40:30,890 --> 00:40:27,020
probably what I'll tell you you know the

768
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:30,900
1954 wave not only in France then you

769
00:40:38,060 --> 00:40:32,370
know all of Europe there were a number

770
00:40:41,350 --> 00:40:38,070
of cases of small diminutive you know

771
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:41,360
like dwarfed like beings being sighted

772
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:45,690
near landed UFOs and etc etc and some

773
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:47,850
from South America but they're there

774
00:40:53,110 --> 00:40:50,370
another another year that I was just

775
00:40:56,690 --> 00:40:53,120
looking into the other day was actually

776
00:40:58,070 --> 00:40:56,700
1955 there a heck of a number of reports

777
00:41:00,310 --> 00:40:58,080
just right off you want to hear one

778
00:41:02,690 --> 00:41:00,320
right off the bat yeah absolutely

779
00:41:06,980 --> 00:41:02,700
yeah well this this one happened about

780
00:41:10,550 --> 00:41:06,990
all just let's bring the witness on okay

781
00:41:12,950 --> 00:41:10,560
yeah there we go I wish I could anyway

782
00:41:15,350 --> 00:41:12,960
it's from Riverside California I think

783
00:41:17,990 --> 00:41:15,360
it's right around August 30th 55 there

784
00:41:19,610 --> 00:41:18,000
were a group of children and they were

785
00:41:22,460 --> 00:41:19,620
talking about an incident that occurred

786
00:41:26,750 --> 00:41:22,470
there one boy said he was climbing a

787
00:41:30,190 --> 00:41:26,760
tree and then he saw the first of a

788
00:41:32,870 --> 00:41:30,200
series of UFOs saucer shaped objects

789
00:41:35,359 --> 00:41:32,880
appeared silver arm

790
00:41:37,999 --> 00:41:35,369
mekka to him and he just floated off

791
00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:38,009
into space he he didn't know how he got

792
00:41:44,599 --> 00:41:40,170
you know but he just exploded off into

793
00:41:47,170 --> 00:41:44,609
space and then he the guy who the boy

794
00:41:49,849 --> 00:41:47,180
landed on his head and hurt and then

795
00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:49,859
another child from the group at the same

796
00:41:53,839 --> 00:41:51,930
incident said he saw a small man about

797
00:41:55,730 --> 00:41:53,849
three and a feet tall get of a

798
00:41:58,160 --> 00:41:55,740
saucer-shaped thing that has landed in

799
00:42:00,559 --> 00:41:58,170
the field nearby and he said the thing

800
00:42:02,660 --> 00:42:00,569
in like big red eyes a big red mouth and

801
00:42:05,210 --> 00:42:02,670
diamonds force diamond-shaped things

802
00:42:08,900 --> 00:42:05,220
where those should be and another kid

803
00:42:12,470 --> 00:42:08,910
told reporters he saw a strange sort of

804
00:42:15,950 --> 00:42:12,480
a guy carrying two gun like things which

805
00:42:18,609 --> 00:42:15,960
paralyzed to the other kids and and it's

806
00:42:21,559 --> 00:42:18,619
and we're really really weird story

807
00:42:24,920 --> 00:42:21,569
where was this in your backyard rivers

808
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:24,930
no they oh yeah actually is Riverside

809
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:27,210
California I mean you know you expect

810
00:42:32,900 --> 00:42:28,410
something like in Southern California

811
00:42:34,609 --> 00:42:32,910
won't you tell well absolutely well I I

812
00:42:38,299 --> 00:42:34,619
remember you we're talking about the

813
00:42:41,539 --> 00:42:38,309
friendship flap is like a case where

814
00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:41,549
didn't one of these objects of like Lynn

815
00:42:46,099 --> 00:42:43,410
and a railroad track or something and

816
00:42:47,930 --> 00:42:46,109
the yeah yeah that was that kinda that

817
00:42:50,240 --> 00:42:47,940
got a lot of attention at the time and

818
00:42:52,759 --> 00:42:50,250
then one of my favorites is or at least

819
00:42:54,680 --> 00:42:52,769
I like the the illustration was the

820
00:42:59,120 --> 00:42:54,690
woman where the aliens tried to steal

821
00:43:01,670 --> 00:42:59,130
her stockings yes yes I doesn't like a

822
00:43:03,170 --> 00:43:01,680
good pair of pantyhose on Mars I would

823
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:03,180
guess you know I yeah that's right

824
00:43:10,309 --> 00:43:05,130
that's just better than Hershey bars I

825
00:43:12,200 --> 00:43:10,319
guess some are you know well she was

826
00:43:15,829 --> 00:43:12,210
carrying she was carrying a handful of

827
00:43:18,589 --> 00:43:15,839
like flowers or plants in one hand and

828
00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:18,599
then her stockings in the other so maybe

829
00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:20,130
maybe they thought they were just

830
00:43:23,089 --> 00:43:22,170
getting hold of some kind of this really

831
00:43:27,230 --> 00:43:23,099
were weird

832
00:43:29,870 --> 00:43:27,240
terrestrial plant very strange indeed

833
00:43:31,730 --> 00:43:29,880
but you know these people told these of

834
00:43:35,089 --> 00:43:31,740
these encounters with a very straight

835
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:35,099
face I mean it wasn't like they were you

836
00:43:39,799 --> 00:43:37,410
know and making them making them up I

837
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:39,809
mean it doesn't seem that way anyway but

838
00:43:46,490 --> 00:43:43,410
the the odd thing about it would you

839
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:46,500
both agree that or that

840
00:43:50,900 --> 00:43:49,170
all the humanoids had different

841
00:43:53,900 --> 00:43:50,910
characteristics I mean it didn't seem

842
00:43:56,630 --> 00:43:53,910
like outside of the Nordic types it

843
00:43:59,420 --> 00:43:56,640
didn't seem like you know they were all

844
00:44:03,860 --> 00:43:59,430
coming from the same you know planet or

845
00:44:06,110 --> 00:44:03,870
dimension yeah it seemed like that the

846
00:44:08,990 --> 00:44:06,120
orbs could just change into any shape

847
00:44:11,300 --> 00:44:09,000
and maybe some people say well these are

848
00:44:14,180 --> 00:44:11,310
different races or something but it may

849
00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:14,190
be that it just they just take whatever

850
00:44:21,380 --> 00:44:17,130
shape they want to and the phenomena

851
00:44:23,210 --> 00:44:21,390
does and they sort of fool people into

852
00:44:25,430 --> 00:44:23,220
thinking well this is one type this is

853
00:44:27,830 --> 00:44:25,440
another third type because there seems

854
00:44:29,690 --> 00:44:27,840
to be a huge variation oh well yeah I

855
00:44:33,470 --> 00:44:29,700
mean there's nothing like a hairy beast

856
00:44:36,170 --> 00:44:33,480
breathing down your back yeah yeah but

857
00:44:39,020 --> 00:44:36,180
you know the whole joke yeah go ahead

858
00:44:41,480 --> 00:44:39,030
Ricky so up until the whole I think

859
00:44:43,130 --> 00:44:41,490
what's happened over the years and you

860
00:44:44,930 --> 00:44:43,140
know you study these cases and I've

861
00:44:48,650 --> 00:44:44,940
studied these cases for years and years

862
00:44:51,470 --> 00:44:48,660
and in in the early beginning the big

863
00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:51,480
large the Nordic type creatures that we

864
00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:53,370
you know that a report of the beings

865
00:44:58,010 --> 00:44:55,890
let's not call them creatures where the

866
00:44:59,840 --> 00:44:58,020
space brothers that the contest is all

867
00:45:02,510 --> 00:44:59,850
reported like a damn scheme the third

868
00:45:04,340 --> 00:45:02,520
bathroom and in angelou sea and so all

869
00:45:07,910 --> 00:45:04,350
of all abundant another sector all a

870
00:45:10,460 --> 00:45:07,920
bunch of Nazis yeah really could be

871
00:45:13,610 --> 00:45:10,470
could not seize whatever firm or orphan

872
00:45:15,620 --> 00:45:13,620
from Venus now yeah he was him he had no

873
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:15,630
ties to Hitler at all but then I don't

874
00:45:20,360 --> 00:45:17,570
know he hadn't rebel he had two swastika

875
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:20,370
advances the swastika on the bottom of

876
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:23,490
his boot yeah well that's a native

877
00:45:28,220 --> 00:45:26,010
that's a that's a universally they're

878
00:45:31,220 --> 00:45:28,230
the Native Americans use the same symbol

879
00:45:32,810 --> 00:45:31,230
so that's what we're here for

880
00:45:34,220 --> 00:45:32,820
if you're coming here from Venus why

881
00:45:35,510 --> 00:45:34,230
would you have that in place you know on

882
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:35,520
the bottom of your boot that doesn't

883
00:45:39,650 --> 00:45:37,170
that doesn't make that a good question

884
00:45:41,390 --> 00:45:39,660
yeah it doesn't make sense and and

885
00:45:43,670 --> 00:45:41,400
George hunt Williamson if you remember

886
00:45:46,460 --> 00:45:43,680
correctly who led a damn ski to the spot

887
00:45:50,300 --> 00:45:46,470
where this encounter took place had a

888
00:45:51,470 --> 00:45:50,310
course that ties with the American Nazi

889
00:45:55,910 --> 00:45:51,480
Party I don't think they call themselves

890
00:45:57,890 --> 00:45:55,920
that but you know a group of neo-nazis

891
00:46:00,290 --> 00:45:57,900
that existed in fact our leader I think

892
00:46:01,850 --> 00:46:00,300
went to the telly what to jail for

893
00:46:03,590 --> 00:46:01,860
a couple years I don't know they're just

894
00:46:05,570 --> 00:46:03,600
that you know we did this book that Nazi

895
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:05,580
UFO time travels through there seems to

896
00:46:10,430 --> 00:46:08,490
be a very strong and not so your UFO it

897
00:46:14,030 --> 00:46:10,440
can actually I mean that's the way I see

898
00:46:16,460 --> 00:46:14,040
it in fact a lot of the these beings

899
00:46:18,710 --> 00:46:16,470
that look like us you know the Aryan

900
00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:18,720
nordica types they spoke to some of them

901
00:46:23,510 --> 00:46:21,570
even spoken in German if you remember

902
00:46:26,270 --> 00:46:23,520
the Kaiser Reinhold okay fine house

903
00:46:28,160 --> 00:46:26,280
right home I could hear yeah that's

904
00:46:31,910 --> 00:46:28,170
that's correct and there were a few

905
00:46:34,430 --> 00:46:31,920
other reports around that time in fact I

906
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:34,440
think that a danske even the said that

907
00:46:37,730 --> 00:46:35,610
at one point he caught them

908
00:46:39,470 --> 00:46:37,740
speaking in German in a yes why are you

909
00:46:41,060 --> 00:46:39,480
speaking in German and I said all we

910
00:46:43,520 --> 00:46:41,070
could to speak getting leg which we want

911
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:43,530
oh how convenient

912
00:46:51,020 --> 00:46:48,690
yeah but but the affected maybe for

913
00:46:54,020 --> 00:46:51,030
perhaps a more these more serious

914
00:46:56,930 --> 00:46:54,030
reports I also noticed that dr. Scott in

915
00:46:59,030 --> 00:46:56,940
your book you talk about the some of the

916
00:47:04,250 --> 00:46:59,040
sightings by police officers and chairs

917
00:47:07,310 --> 00:47:04,260
and deputies yes one of the biggest ones

918
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:07,320
was one that it was called the Portage

919
00:47:16,850 --> 00:47:12,290
County a chase and it was a very highly

920
00:47:22,430 --> 00:47:16,860
dramatic and very well verified

921
00:47:24,350 --> 00:47:22,440
encounter it took place in several

922
00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:24,360
states that started out in Michigan it

923
00:47:33,740 --> 00:47:27,210
took place across Ohio that continued

924
00:47:39,230 --> 00:47:33,750
into Pennsylvania and there were it was

925
00:47:42,410 --> 00:47:39,240
that by deputy sheriff I can spar and

926
00:47:43,820 --> 00:47:42,420
nap dr. Scott let me have you hold your

927
00:47:47,300 --> 00:47:43,830
thought there because we're coming up to

928
00:47:49,190 --> 00:47:47,310
our top of the show break when we come

929
00:47:52,540 --> 00:47:49,200
back we will continue our conversation

930
00:47:53,660 --> 00:47:52,550
with dr. Irene Scott and Rick Gilbert

931
00:48:00,640 --> 00:47:53,670
unemployed

932
00:48:00,650 --> 00:48:04,989
[Music]

933
00:48:11,949 --> 00:48:10,009
explode the bazaar your e-ticket riders

934
00:48:15,259 --> 00:48:11,959
of the world of the paranoid

935
00:48:19,539 --> 00:48:15,269
strap yourself in as we traverse the

936
00:48:22,660 --> 00:48:19,549
universe exploring the unexplained UFO

937
00:48:25,039 --> 00:48:22,670
ghosts lost world

938
00:48:28,910 --> 00:48:25,049
cryptozoology as well as other

939
00:48:33,319 --> 00:48:28,920
dimensions it's time to take back the

940
00:48:36,559 --> 00:48:33,329
night at midnight now your electrifying

941
00:48:42,769 --> 00:48:36,569
hosts of exploring the bizarre Timothy

942
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:42,779
Begley and team sports and one back to

943
00:48:49,279 --> 00:48:45,410
exploring the bizarre I'm Tim sports and

944
00:48:53,799 --> 00:48:49,289
tonight we're talking about UFOs they're

945
00:48:56,719 --> 00:48:53,809
kind of a strange and convoluted history

946
00:48:59,779 --> 00:48:56,729
especially here in the United States and

947
00:49:03,109 --> 00:48:59,789
we're talking about with doctor Irena

948
00:49:05,779 --> 00:49:03,119
Scott and her newly released book I

949
00:49:09,380 --> 00:49:05,789
think it just came out on the the first

950
00:49:12,349 --> 00:49:09,390
one this month UFOs today and Tim I

951
00:49:14,989 --> 00:49:12,359
think Rick have some questions that yeah

952
00:49:18,249 --> 00:49:14,999
yeah I want to I want to return the the

953
00:49:20,779 --> 00:49:18,259
platform over to it to Rick who's a

954
00:49:24,140 --> 00:49:20,789
Association that we've been involved

955
00:49:26,979 --> 00:49:24,150
since the nineteen that their 60s we

956
00:49:31,039 --> 00:49:26,989
were both founding members of the

957
00:49:33,410 --> 00:49:31,049
Congress of scientific ufologist which

958
00:49:35,749 --> 00:49:33,420
which still exists I guess a name only

959
00:49:38,749 --> 00:49:35,759
although we did have a super secret

960
00:49:41,269 --> 00:49:38,759
meeting in Cleveland there was that two

961
00:49:43,279 --> 00:49:41,279
summers ago networks yeah there was just

962
00:49:45,699 --> 00:49:43,289
about two years ago this coming weekend

963
00:49:49,339 --> 00:49:45,709
yeah we got it we got to do it again

964
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:49,349
please read on Tilly's yeah by if I own

965
00:49:54,559 --> 00:49:52,890
me now yeah yeah I am anyway Rick what

966
00:49:57,640 --> 00:49:54,569
what did you tell us about your

967
00:50:02,449 --> 00:49:57,650
involvement with this a the project that

968
00:50:04,519 --> 00:50:02,459
dr. Scott has been so I mean she's just

969
00:50:07,039 --> 00:50:04,529
done a fabulous job of putting this book

970
00:50:11,539 --> 00:50:07,049
together in fact I would say if you're

971
00:50:15,380 --> 00:50:11,549
going to buy a serious book on UFOs you

972
00:50:17,870 --> 00:50:15,390
know a historical book this is the one

973
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:17,880
book you should certainly purchase

974
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:18,450
because

975
00:50:25,400 --> 00:50:20,970
it's got everything in there I mean it's

976
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:25,410
just a fabulous overview of the history

977
00:50:30,950 --> 00:50:29,130
of UFOs in America it's I would say them

978
00:50:36,140 --> 00:50:30,960
it's the most complete thorough book

979
00:50:40,370 --> 00:50:36,150
even beyond the UFO encyclopedia okay

980
00:50:42,620 --> 00:50:40,380
and actually is yeah yeah well I did one

981
00:50:46,490 --> 00:50:42,630
thing I mean the reason I got involved

982
00:50:49,370 --> 00:50:46,500
was I got quite a collection of UFO

983
00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:49,380
photographs and and dr. Scott you know

984
00:50:54,049 --> 00:50:51,450
was asking if I had some that she could

985
00:50:55,789 --> 00:50:54,059
use and I've been collecting them for

986
00:50:59,180 --> 00:50:55,799
you know years and years and years and I

987
00:51:03,200 --> 00:50:59,190
was more than happy to be able to they

988
00:51:05,210 --> 00:51:03,210
were in slide form as I recall and she

989
00:51:08,120 --> 00:51:05,220
has a scanner that there there are

990
00:51:10,430 --> 00:51:08,130
scanners out there they can you know

991
00:51:12,049 --> 00:51:10,440
scan transparency so I sent them along

992
00:51:14,210 --> 00:51:12,059
to her and she was able to use them in

993
00:51:16,849 --> 00:51:14,220
her book and I'm grateful that she was

994
00:51:21,470 --> 00:51:16,859
you know asking me and that I was able

995
00:51:23,390 --> 00:51:21,480
to help her and one of the things I have

996
00:51:26,809 --> 00:51:23,400
to agree with you tended is a very

997
00:51:30,740 --> 00:51:26,819
complete book as far as the chronology

998
00:51:33,829 --> 00:51:30,750
of the the saucer events since you know

999
00:51:35,859 --> 00:51:33,839
even before Arnold and on up until the

1000
00:51:38,359 --> 00:51:35,869
present time is very meticulously

1001
00:51:40,099 --> 00:51:38,369
footnoted and researched I think as you

1002
00:51:42,410 --> 00:51:40,109
said that this is the one book to get

1003
00:51:46,670 --> 00:51:42,420
because it is really a scholarly work

1004
00:51:49,370 --> 00:51:46,680
but I'd like to ask dr. Scott you

1005
00:51:51,950 --> 00:51:49,380
mentioned the brennick case April 17 to

1006
00:51:54,500 --> 00:51:51,960
66 but the spar enough and the big chase

1007
00:51:58,220 --> 00:51:54,510
and everything and of course we all know

1008
00:52:00,200 --> 00:51:58,230
that spar received a lot of negative

1009
00:52:02,270 --> 00:52:00,210
publicity not only from people on the

1010
00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:02,280
police force but the general public

1011
00:52:06,500 --> 00:52:04,530
which eventually forced him to resign

1012
00:52:10,130 --> 00:52:06,510
from the force and live almost as a

1013
00:52:12,559 --> 00:52:10,140
recluse it cost miss marriage is job you

1014
00:52:16,039 --> 00:52:12,569
know the whole nine yards in your

1015
00:52:18,319 --> 00:52:16,049
research irena have you have you know

1016
00:52:20,510 --> 00:52:18,329
this is trend and in some of the

1017
00:52:23,120 --> 00:52:20,520
instances where you know public

1018
00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:23,130
officials police officers etc etcetera

1019
00:52:30,440 --> 00:52:25,410
you know have made their reports public

1020
00:52:32,240 --> 00:52:30,450
I think I yes I have and I think spar

1021
00:52:35,180 --> 00:52:32,250
was the absolute

1022
00:52:38,060 --> 00:52:35,190
case I came across because he had a

1023
00:52:40,370 --> 00:52:38,070
really good sighting he had many many

1024
00:52:42,830 --> 00:52:40,380
other witnesses he was on the police

1025
00:52:47,420 --> 00:52:42,840
radio for hours why he's having a

1026
00:52:52,850 --> 00:52:47,430
sighting it was just a what you'd call

1027
00:52:58,640 --> 00:52:52,860
it alive and he talked to authorities

1028
00:53:01,220 --> 00:52:58,650
people saw the UFO on radar jets were

1029
00:53:06,880 --> 00:53:01,230
scrambled and everything else but

1030
00:53:10,370 --> 00:53:06,890
afterwards he had this misfortune of

1031
00:53:12,950 --> 00:53:10,380
getting in contact with this person in I

1032
00:53:15,140 --> 00:53:12,960
mean it was a real-time sighting where

1033
00:53:18,230 --> 00:53:15,150
he reported as he was going along on the

1034
00:53:20,750 --> 00:53:18,240
radio besides everything else he was

1035
00:53:22,790 --> 00:53:20,760
following this object and it would even

1036
00:53:28,250 --> 00:53:22,800
stop and wait for him if he got behind

1037
00:53:32,360 --> 00:53:28,260
it was so interactive but he talked to

1038
00:53:34,310 --> 00:53:32,370
this man in blue book who was a real

1039
00:53:38,600 --> 00:53:34,320
deep bunker II think his name was quick

1040
00:53:42,020 --> 00:53:38,610
quintanilla and quintanilla tolling even

1041
00:53:44,120 --> 00:53:42,030
though they'd followed this UFO across

1042
00:53:46,940 --> 00:53:44,130
two states they had zillions of

1043
00:53:49,580 --> 00:53:46,950
witnesses they saw close up everything

1044
00:53:53,780 --> 00:53:49,590
else quintanilla told him that he had

1045
00:53:57,650 --> 00:53:53,790
mistaken Venus and a satellite for this

1046
00:54:00,080 --> 00:53:57,660
whole sighting and people just made fun

1047
00:54:02,600 --> 00:54:00,090
of him I mean it was just terrible it

1048
00:54:04,610 --> 00:54:02,610
was the worst I'd ever seen and he just

1049
00:54:07,550 --> 00:54:04,620
wound up both of them all the people

1050
00:54:08,930 --> 00:54:07,560
involved just wound up it was terrible

1051
00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:08,940
let's do the debunking of

1052
00:54:15,350 --> 00:54:11,610
wright-patterson and Blue Book but I

1053
00:54:19,270 --> 00:54:15,360
think other people had less problems

1054
00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:19,280
because one was a coin helicopter in

1055
00:54:29,420 --> 00:54:23,610
1973 in Ohio which I'm sure Rick public

1056
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:29,430
vestigators even maybe but they had a

1057
00:54:33,860 --> 00:54:31,290
close encounter with a UFO and reported

1058
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:33,870
it and they continued their professional

1059
00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:38,370
life and had a good life and respected

1060
00:54:43,120 --> 00:54:40,010
and no problem there was another

1061
00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:43,130
policeman I can't remember his name I

1062
00:54:48,630 --> 00:54:45,610
think it was in Nebraska

1063
00:54:52,380 --> 00:54:48,640
who had this sighting he didn't realize

1064
00:54:55,800 --> 00:54:52,390
it missing time but he got promoted and

1065
00:54:59,880 --> 00:54:55,810
had Shermer travelers murmur yeah yeah

1066
00:55:01,860 --> 00:54:59,890
herb herb shorter sure well but he

1067
00:55:03,510 --> 00:55:01,870
reported that and he got regular

1068
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:03,520
promotions and everything else I don't

1069
00:55:09,630 --> 00:55:05,170
think it happened a lot of people that

1070
00:55:11,820 --> 00:55:09,640
sure happened those spiral now I wonder

1071
00:55:13,530 --> 00:55:11,830
if anybody ever got a date I would ever

1072
00:55:19,020 --> 00:55:13,540
say but he ever got a raised after sake

1073
00:55:23,910 --> 00:55:19,030
a UFO because I think Shermer did and I

1074
00:55:26,700 --> 00:55:23,920
think we coined into the corn now which

1075
00:55:30,750 --> 00:55:26,710
which was the police officer that the

1076
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:30,760
antenna was bent on the car oh god that

1077
00:55:38,810 --> 00:55:35,410
was that was oh god I was like 1975 74

1078
00:55:41,850 --> 00:55:38,820
that was up in Minnesota I think it was

1079
00:55:43,650 --> 00:55:41,860
yeah this thing came close as buzzed his

1080
00:55:46,470 --> 00:55:43,660
police cruiser and he kind of blacked

1081
00:55:48,390 --> 00:55:46,480
out for a minute or two and and you know

1082
00:55:50,610 --> 00:55:48,400
finally got on the radio and asked for

1083
00:55:52,950 --> 00:55:50,620
some help and a fellow officer came and

1084
00:55:55,350 --> 00:55:52,960
there were dense on the car and the

1085
00:55:57,150 --> 00:55:55,360
antenna was you know bent over like you

1086
00:56:00,150 --> 00:55:57,160
know 180 degrees or something

1087
00:56:03,210 --> 00:56:00,160
yeah I went you the windshield I think

1088
00:56:05,040 --> 00:56:03,220
was broken as well yeah I think that's

1089
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:05,050
right - yeah I think it was - yeah my

1090
00:56:09,630 --> 00:56:07,570
thinking when she was correct yeah and

1091
00:56:11,970 --> 00:56:09,640
he was all shook up about it had like a

1092
00:56:13,950 --> 00:56:11,980
little he blacked out or had amnesia or

1093
00:56:16,440 --> 00:56:13,960
something yeah but he didn't get

1094
00:56:18,960 --> 00:56:16,450
ridiculed as I recall he went on to keep

1095
00:56:20,570 --> 00:56:18,970
his job and then of course she had the

1096
00:56:24,030 --> 00:56:20,580
case up there in Exeter New Hampshire

1097
00:56:25,410 --> 00:56:24,040
where the young fella was a walking home

1098
00:56:28,080 --> 00:56:25,420
I guess along

1099
00:56:31,020 --> 00:56:28,090
yeah muscarello yeah much really a very

1100
00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:31,030
a very rural area and sold this thing

1101
00:56:37,500 --> 00:56:34,810
you know over the trees and you know

1102
00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:37,510
bouncing around and I think maybe it

1103
00:56:42,270 --> 00:56:39,130
came to towards him for a brief period

1104
00:56:43,890 --> 00:56:42,280
of time and then he contacted the the

1105
00:56:45,540 --> 00:56:43,900
Sheriff's Department of the police

1106
00:56:47,070 --> 00:56:45,550
department they said oh you know yeah

1107
00:56:48,690 --> 00:56:47,080
what do you but what it was

1108
00:56:50,010 --> 00:56:48,700
what moonshining you've been drinking

1109
00:56:53,190 --> 00:56:50,020
and what do you want nobody smoked pot I

1110
00:56:54,510 --> 00:56:53,200
think in those days probably but do you

1111
00:56:56,640 --> 00:56:54,520
got to blame it you kind of believe it I

1112
00:56:59,250 --> 00:56:56,650
gotta blame it on something right you

1113
00:57:01,290 --> 00:56:59,260
know yeah yeah blame it on something Oh

1114
00:57:04,230 --> 00:57:01,300
so anyway the the sheriff I think went

1115
00:57:05,970 --> 00:57:04,240
back to the to the area there where he

1116
00:57:07,950 --> 00:57:05,980
had seen the sighting and Rome behold

1117
00:57:10,560 --> 00:57:07,960
here comes the object up bouncing up and

1118
00:57:15,780 --> 00:57:10,570
down over the over the trees you know I

1119
00:57:18,200 --> 00:57:15,790
agree with the in fact there's a twenty

1120
00:57:21,510 --> 00:57:18,210
fifteen to 20 minute interview and

1121
00:57:24,270 --> 00:57:21,520
recreation of the account on on youtube

1122
00:57:24,930 --> 00:57:24,280
if you hunt around you know for it in

1123
00:57:27,870 --> 00:57:24,940
fact

1124
00:57:30,570 --> 00:57:27,880
I give you know I do you two-bit to be

1125
00:57:32,430 --> 00:57:30,580
as the the Wayback Machine I mean if you

1126
00:57:35,010 --> 00:57:32,440
search hard and long enough and you know

1127
00:57:38,940 --> 00:57:35,020
what keywords to type in you could find

1128
00:57:41,099 --> 00:57:38,950
almost anything on there I mean it's a

1129
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:41,109
you know it's a remarkable source of you

1130
00:57:45,180 --> 00:57:43,450
know information and and there were

1131
00:57:49,020 --> 00:57:45,190
there were a lot of police well I

1132
00:57:52,680 --> 00:57:49,030
remember I reported on it for a faint

1133
00:57:58,620 --> 00:57:52,690
magazine the rather famous one a key New

1134
00:58:01,800 --> 00:57:58,630
Jersey UFO oh yeah where the the police

1135
00:58:03,599 --> 00:58:01,810
the police the United crew security

1136
00:58:06,840 --> 00:58:03,609
guards I guess they were but they were

1137
00:58:09,270 --> 00:58:06,850
armed over the over the reservoir they

1138
00:58:11,160 --> 00:58:09,280
were walking along the the path they're

1139
00:58:13,859 --> 00:58:11,170
on top of the reservoir they they saw

1140
00:58:16,140 --> 00:58:13,869
the object come over the the reservoir

1141
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:16,150
and actually shoot down a beam of light

1142
00:58:22,410 --> 00:58:20,170
and it melted the the ice yeah there was

1143
00:58:24,810 --> 00:58:22,420
a big hole in the ice right yeah and

1144
00:58:26,690 --> 00:58:24,820
yeah there were any number of police

1145
00:58:29,310 --> 00:58:26,700
officer sightings and then of course

1146
00:58:30,930 --> 00:58:29,320
what's the the most recent ones in

1147
00:58:33,810 --> 00:58:30,940
Illinois what about ten years ago or

1148
00:58:35,910 --> 00:58:33,820
eight years ago where number officers

1149
00:58:39,540 --> 00:58:35,920
went out to yeah more than there but

1150
00:58:42,810 --> 00:58:39,550
it's 2,000 yeah you know I when it comes

1151
00:58:44,550 --> 00:58:42,820
to when it comes to the time it just it

1152
00:58:47,070 --> 00:58:44,560
just slides right out like language I

1153
00:58:48,870 --> 00:58:47,080
yeah yeah I get I get is when it comes

1154
00:58:51,050 --> 00:58:48,880
to time for you for sure you know yeah

1155
00:58:54,140 --> 00:58:51,060
there was I said just just in Illinois

1156
00:58:57,090 --> 00:58:54,150
near st. Louis yeah

1157
00:58:59,310 --> 00:58:57,100
you'll Staten eat a mill stat Illinois

1158
00:59:00,599 --> 00:58:59,320
something like that nakai low Mill Stan

1159
00:59:02,490 --> 00:59:00,609
something like that yeah number of

1160
00:59:05,010 --> 00:59:02,500
police dog departments all those things

1161
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:05,020
yeah well I don't think any of those

1162
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:07,930
guys got ridiculed well what about what

1163
00:59:12,540 --> 00:59:10,690
about that poor sheriff from Alabama who

1164
00:59:16,320 --> 00:59:12,550
took the pictures of the

1165
00:59:17,490 --> 00:59:16,330
the the aluminum foil clad alien and I

1166
00:59:22,800 --> 00:59:17,500
mean that just that just completely

1167
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:22,810
ruined his life was his name yeah green

1168
00:59:27,390 --> 00:59:25,330
ha well you know we are you have a we

1169
00:59:30,030 --> 00:59:27,400
had we had a fellow of the other program

1170
00:59:31,820 --> 00:59:30,040
Tim I I think he's a a friend of yours

1171
00:59:35,460 --> 00:59:31,830
who actually found the exact spot where

1172
00:59:36,900 --> 00:59:35,470
yes yes yeah Michael right yeah yeah in

1173
00:59:39,660 --> 00:59:36,910
fact he's gonna be on the program again

1174
00:59:41,940 --> 00:59:39,670
in a you know in a couple of weeks here

1175
00:59:45,839 --> 00:59:41,950
he he travels all over the country

1176
00:59:47,910 --> 00:59:45,849
looking for the places where these a UFO

1177
00:59:49,710 --> 00:59:47,920
incidents have taken place I mean he's

1178
00:59:52,079 --> 00:59:49,720
got you know me I don't know you Google

1179
00:59:54,089 --> 00:59:52,089
Maps it or what he does but he he gets

1180
00:59:56,040 --> 00:59:54,099
right to I mean he had to check around

1181
01:00:00,359 --> 00:59:56,050
there for that information on the find

1182
01:00:02,790 --> 01:00:00,369
the exact spot where that spaceman had

1183
01:00:05,760 --> 01:00:02,800
you know had to come out of the had come

1184
01:00:08,190 --> 01:00:05,770
out of the darkness and being so it you

1185
01:00:09,570 --> 01:00:08,200
know it was a it had to be a hoax well I

1186
01:00:11,609 --> 01:00:09,580
don't know if it had to be a hoax when

1187
01:00:12,990 --> 01:00:11,619
you consider all the strange kind of

1188
01:00:16,170 --> 01:00:13,000
creatures that have been the you know

1189
01:00:17,910 --> 01:00:16,180
seeing over the years every once in a

1190
01:00:19,560 --> 01:00:17,920
while maybe one will show up in some

1191
01:00:24,260 --> 01:00:19,570
sort of space suit could be a time

1192
01:00:27,120 --> 01:00:24,270
traveler well I mean yes case go ahead

1193
01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:27,130
in this case though the green hawk case

1194
01:00:30,960 --> 01:00:29,410
from 75 was 73 when he took those

1195
01:00:33,660 --> 01:00:30,970
Polaroids or whatever the heck it was

1196
01:00:36,930 --> 01:00:33,670
yeah this guy or at the thing and the

1197
01:00:39,510 --> 01:00:36,940
suit didn't it pursue the car like a 35

1198
01:00:41,880 --> 01:00:39,520
40 miles an hour or he chased it or

1199
01:00:43,890 --> 01:00:41,890
something after he took the photographs

1200
01:00:46,050 --> 01:00:43,900
so I you know how can you have some guy

1201
01:00:50,180 --> 01:00:46,060
dressed up in tinfoil fooling some cop

1202
01:00:52,290 --> 01:00:50,190
they can run 30 35 40 miles an hour so I

1203
01:00:54,270 --> 01:00:52,300
don't think you could lie about that

1204
01:00:56,460 --> 01:00:54,280
today the cop of put his gun out the

1205
01:00:59,099 --> 01:00:56,470
window and put a couple of bullets in

1206
01:01:03,660 --> 01:00:59,109
and probably at huh yeah warning shots

1207
01:01:05,609 --> 01:01:03,670
of the way where we gotta said we're

1208
01:01:07,620 --> 01:01:05,619
gonna send this guy back to Venus all

1209
01:01:11,490 --> 01:01:07,630
right

1210
01:01:13,260 --> 01:01:11,500
yeah but green all I mean his after that

1211
01:01:15,800 --> 01:01:13,270
I mean he was fired from his job his

1212
01:01:18,570 --> 01:01:15,810
wife divorced him his house burnt down

1213
01:01:22,200 --> 01:01:18,580
yeah I mean you talk about a spate of

1214
01:01:25,710 --> 01:01:22,210
bad luck go baby was worse off inspire

1215
01:01:32,010 --> 01:01:28,710
but do the debunking from the government

1216
01:01:34,020 --> 01:01:32,020
- I mean people honestly turn in reports

1217
01:01:36,030 --> 01:01:34,030
and the government tells them yeah well

1218
01:01:37,589 --> 01:01:36,040
you just saw Venus when they saw

1219
01:01:41,900 --> 01:01:37,599
something laying in their yard and that

1220
01:01:46,170 --> 01:01:41,910
sort of thing how are you a brother yep

1221
01:01:48,540 --> 01:01:46,180
dr. Scott is there how have things

1222
01:01:50,280 --> 01:01:48,550
changed over the year I mean is there a

1223
01:01:53,220 --> 01:01:50,290
difference in the pattern of sightings

1224
01:01:57,330 --> 01:01:53,230
today than in in previous decades would

1225
01:01:59,180 --> 01:01:57,340
you say well it's hard to answer that

1226
01:02:01,980 --> 01:01:59,190
because you don't know how much people

1227
01:02:05,760 --> 01:02:01,990
reported or how much they didn't report

1228
01:02:07,680 --> 01:02:05,770
in past decades because now people

1229
01:02:10,830 --> 01:02:07,690
report abductions and things like that

1230
01:02:13,349 --> 01:02:10,840
but nobody ever heard of a an abduction

1231
01:02:15,330 --> 01:02:13,359
back in the 50s so they didn't report it

1232
01:02:19,530 --> 01:02:15,340
I mean they did a little bit look it

1233
01:02:22,680 --> 01:02:19,540
wasn't common and so I think it's it's

1234
01:02:24,420 --> 01:02:22,690
hard to tell because I as I started out

1235
01:02:28,500 --> 01:02:24,430
my book a lot of things were happening

1236
01:02:31,170 --> 01:02:28,510
and back in the 1940s that just weren't

1237
01:02:34,109 --> 01:02:31,180
reported because then nobody had ever

1238
01:02:38,220 --> 01:02:34,119
heard of them before well well that's

1239
01:02:41,070 --> 01:02:38,230
the problem with the with the euro with

1240
01:02:43,170 --> 01:02:41,080
the UFOs you don't know exactly what a

1241
01:02:46,530 --> 01:02:43,180
UFO is therefore you don't know what

1242
01:02:47,849 --> 01:02:46,540
category to put it you know in it

1243
01:02:50,760 --> 01:02:47,859
doesn't mean that what the police

1244
01:02:54,060 --> 01:02:50,770
officer in Minnesota soil is the same

1245
01:02:59,310 --> 01:02:54,070
thing that stopped the vehicle on the

1246
01:03:01,200 --> 01:02:59,320
highway in in you know Texas I mean can

1247
01:03:03,240 --> 01:03:01,210
we get two completely different things

1248
01:03:06,599 --> 01:03:03,250
the device are you speaking of Texas did

1249
01:03:12,570 --> 01:03:06,609
I see something in your book irena about

1250
01:03:15,030 --> 01:03:12,580
Marfa yeah um that was everybody asked

1251
01:03:19,400 --> 01:03:15,040
me did you ever have a sighting and so

1252
01:03:23,190 --> 01:03:19,410
anyway I don't know if I did or not but

1253
01:03:27,060 --> 01:03:23,200
Martha is a town in Texas that's no

1254
01:03:30,120 --> 01:03:27,070
known for its repeatable UFO phenomena

1255
01:03:31,920 --> 01:03:30,130
of people see lights every so often

1256
01:03:35,220 --> 01:03:31,930
around Marfa and they're called the

1257
01:03:37,500 --> 01:03:35,230
Marfa lights oh you're that oh yeah oh

1258
01:03:39,180 --> 01:03:37,510
by all means yeah but now there are

1259
01:03:42,150 --> 01:03:39,190
other locales

1260
01:03:44,400 --> 01:03:42,160
of course our longtime associate Alan

1261
01:03:47,760 --> 01:03:44,410
Greenfield and I went with Jim Mosley on

1262
01:03:50,790 --> 01:03:47,770
Christmas Eve of all times down to Brown

1263
01:03:53,190 --> 01:03:50,800
Mountain Inn in North Carolina which has

1264
01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:53,200
been a place where these uh you know

1265
01:03:59,730 --> 01:03:55,450
similar lights have been seen over the

1266
01:04:02,160 --> 01:03:59,740
course of a century or more and then I'm

1267
01:04:05,190 --> 01:04:02,170
very impressed by this place and I think

1268
01:04:07,740 --> 01:04:05,200
it is it in Norway a Rick where they've

1269
01:04:09,510 --> 01:04:07,750
actually had taken motion pictures and

1270
01:04:12,450 --> 01:04:09,520
video of these objects in the yeah yeah

1271
01:04:14,490 --> 01:04:12,460
yeah yeah in fact dr. Hynek went out

1272
01:04:17,099 --> 01:04:14,500
there and investigated the first

1273
01:04:20,790 --> 01:04:17,109
fantastical Norway yeah they actually

1274
01:04:22,740 --> 01:04:20,800
had they set up a an observer post and

1275
01:04:25,170 --> 01:04:22,750
of course even in this country now we do

1276
01:04:27,120 --> 01:04:25,180
have I guess you would call them sky

1277
01:04:29,700 --> 01:04:27,130
watch towers they used to be one down in

1278
01:04:31,950 --> 01:04:29,710
Brown Mountain but I think that fell to

1279
01:04:34,650 --> 01:04:31,960
the ground that years ago there was one

1280
01:04:37,559 --> 01:04:34,660
up on the Indian Reservation in Yakima

1281
01:04:42,180 --> 01:04:37,569
Washington and yessum

1282
01:04:44,120 --> 01:04:42,190
of course is the the town where Ken

1283
01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:44,130
authorial landed after his signing over

1284
01:04:50,690 --> 01:04:48,010
Mount Ranier that's where the pilot of

1285
01:04:53,490 --> 01:04:50,700
the the press the fella from the media

1286
01:04:56,550 --> 01:04:53,500
you know interviewed him about his his

1287
01:04:59,910 --> 01:04:56,560
sighting that was in Yakima right Tim

1288
01:05:04,410 --> 01:04:59,920
you just like saying Yakima you know we

1289
01:05:06,510 --> 01:05:04,420
went through the years and years ago we

1290
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:06,520
just made me think about yakima yeah

1291
01:05:11,300 --> 01:05:09,490
yeah every every time it rolls off my

1292
01:05:15,240 --> 01:05:11,310
tongue there's just something about that

1293
01:05:16,980 --> 01:05:15,250
that that name there but there's a there

1294
01:05:22,500 --> 01:05:16,990
is a fellow who I don't know if he's a

1295
01:05:25,620 --> 01:05:22,510
ranger or what who has kept abreast of

1296
01:05:27,390 --> 01:05:25,630
the UFO reports over the years there and

1297
01:05:30,599 --> 01:05:27,400
they have photographs you know taken

1298
01:05:33,270 --> 01:05:30,609
them from their UFO Watchtower if that

1299
01:05:35,760 --> 01:05:33,280
still exists there and and of course of

1300
01:05:38,880 --> 01:05:35,770
that where would you say both you can

1301
01:05:40,920 --> 01:05:38,890
chime in on this or anybody here with

1302
01:05:43,349 --> 01:05:40,930
where is the most UFO activity today

1303
01:05:46,349 --> 01:05:43,359
would you say I mean are you still

1304
01:05:49,079 --> 01:05:46,359
collecting a irena reports on a regular

1305
01:05:51,120 --> 01:05:49,089
basis like it lots of reports from

1306
01:05:52,490 --> 01:05:51,130
people I know around here that never

1307
01:05:54,590 --> 01:05:52,500
reported them and

1308
01:05:56,480 --> 01:05:54,600
people kind of laugh when you say you've

1309
01:06:00,200 --> 01:05:56,490
written a book and then people come up

1310
01:06:05,360 --> 01:06:00,210
privately and tell you they saw UFO so

1311
01:06:07,520 --> 01:06:05,370
it's hard to say because there's so the

1312
01:06:11,840 --> 01:06:07,530
people just don't report much because of

1313
01:06:14,120 --> 01:06:11,850
all the problems so I hadn't and

1314
01:06:15,740 --> 01:06:14,130
anything that's exceptional that the

1315
01:06:19,370 --> 01:06:15,750
Rings Abela with you I mean as far as

1316
01:06:22,010 --> 01:06:19,380
report those kind of reports go well I

1317
01:06:24,320 --> 01:06:22,020
read some several places on the internet

1318
01:06:26,180 --> 01:06:24,330
that they've been receiving more reports

1319
01:06:28,490 --> 01:06:26,190
these last years and they ever did

1320
01:06:30,830 --> 01:06:28,500
before but maybe that's because people

1321
01:06:35,420 --> 01:06:30,840
are reporting more so I I just don't

1322
01:06:38,330 --> 01:06:35,430
know I'm just of course a more I was

1323
01:06:41,360 --> 01:06:38,340
going to say media attention you know on

1324
01:06:43,460 --> 01:06:41,370
the cable channels and all them I'm not

1325
01:06:46,090 --> 01:06:43,470
sure that it's all very good media

1326
01:06:49,190 --> 01:06:46,100
attention but it is a attention

1327
01:06:52,580 --> 01:06:49,200
nonetheless in fact you know there is a

1328
01:06:53,680 --> 01:06:52,590
new program that's going to be on the

1329
01:06:56,450 --> 01:06:53,690
History Channel

1330
01:07:01,550 --> 01:06:56,460
based on some of the unsolved reports

1331
01:07:04,550 --> 01:07:01,560
from the project Bluebook files and I

1332
01:07:06,980 --> 01:07:04,560
guess somehow they have a dr. Hynek as

1333
01:07:09,820 --> 01:07:06,990
the chief investigator which he really

1334
01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:09,830
wasn't he was an astronomer that they

1335
01:07:16,400 --> 01:07:12,810
had hired anyway I heard that recently

1336
01:07:18,080 --> 01:07:16,410
from a couple of you know researchers

1337
01:07:20,950 --> 01:07:18,090
they were very upset that the History

1338
01:07:25,480 --> 01:07:20,960
Channel had signed a press release and

1339
01:07:27,680 --> 01:07:25,490
misidentified dr. hynek's role in the

1340
01:07:30,800 --> 01:07:27,690
investigating investigating some of

1341
01:07:33,140 --> 01:07:30,810
these cases but nonetheless it is it is

1342
01:07:34,640 --> 01:07:33,150
what it is and you know it depends on

1343
01:07:38,180 --> 01:07:34,650
how it's done you know I mean to create

1344
01:07:40,640 --> 01:07:38,190
it could be done very well and it could

1345
01:07:43,700 --> 01:07:40,650
be done you know like very chin so and

1346
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:43,710
like monster quest or something you know

1347
01:07:49,910 --> 01:07:45,930
I remember there was a program in the

1348
01:07:53,720 --> 01:07:49,920
late what was it 1970s the network

1349
01:07:56,150 --> 01:07:53,730
television show I decided on NBC I think

1350
01:08:04,900 --> 01:07:56,160
it was yeah yeah it's just you a UFO

1351
01:08:13,039 --> 01:08:08,809
Ezekiel saw the wheel this is the wheel

1352
01:08:15,559 --> 01:08:13,049
he said he saw these are unidentified

1353
01:08:19,249 --> 01:08:15,569
flying objects that people say they are

1354
01:08:21,379 --> 01:08:19,259
seeing now are they proof that we are

1355
01:08:25,989 --> 01:08:21,389
being visited by civilizations from

1356
01:08:28,359 --> 01:08:25,999
other stars or just what are they

1357
01:08:30,430 --> 01:08:28,369
the United States Air Force began an

1358
01:08:33,700 --> 01:08:30,440
investigation of this high strangeness

1359
01:08:36,759 --> 01:08:33,710
in a search for the truth what you were

1360
01:08:39,370 --> 01:08:36,769
about to see is part of that 20 years

1361
01:08:42,399 --> 01:08:39,380
search that's an accident and you know

1362
01:08:45,370 --> 01:08:42,409
it was Jack Webb Jack Webb sorry Jack

1363
01:08:48,819 --> 01:08:45,380
Reed you know that still has a pretty

1364
01:08:51,519 --> 01:08:48,829
strong fan base that I mean if you go to

1365
01:08:55,120 --> 01:08:51,529
the you to the internet and you know you

1366
01:08:56,829 --> 01:08:55,130
type in UFO a lot of times that's what

1367
01:09:03,549 --> 01:08:56,839
you'll get you'll need to get tube and

1368
01:09:06,129 --> 01:09:03,559
UFO or the or the TV the TV program the

1369
01:09:08,229 --> 01:09:06,139
I guess that lasted a couple of seasons

1370
01:09:10,269 --> 01:09:08,239
and in the beginning it started out

1371
01:09:13,089 --> 01:09:10,279
where it was going to be legitimate you

1372
01:09:15,009 --> 01:09:13,099
know in cases or something but then you

1373
01:09:16,239 --> 01:09:15,019
know it fell apart pretty quickly and

1374
01:09:20,410 --> 01:09:16,249
you could tell that there wasn't any

1375
01:09:22,539 --> 01:09:20,420
there's nothing worse than a legitimate

1376
01:09:25,450 --> 01:09:22,549
case that's being presented as a real

1377
01:09:27,249 --> 01:09:25,460
case and a lot of movies have done that

1378
01:09:29,349 --> 01:09:27,259
recently too you know based on the files

1379
01:09:32,739 --> 01:09:29,359
of blah blah blah with paranormal group

1380
01:09:35,129 --> 01:09:32,749
or something like that and or or my

1381
01:09:38,859 --> 01:09:35,139
least favorite has to be Lost Tapes

1382
01:09:40,989 --> 01:09:38,869
where somebody has found that yet just

1383
01:09:43,989 --> 01:09:40,999
terrible terrible stuff I mean you know

1384
01:09:47,529 --> 01:09:43,999
I don't notice has anybody done a Lost

1385
01:09:49,329 --> 01:09:47,539
Tapes movie based on UFOs I think it

1386
01:09:52,359 --> 01:09:49,339
mostly it's been like paranormal stuff

1387
01:09:55,209 --> 01:09:52,369
well actually now yes there there are a

1388
01:09:58,419 --> 01:09:55,219
couple of movies out about the Phoenix

1389
01:10:00,520 --> 01:09:58,429
lights mmm and that have just come out

1390
01:10:04,930 --> 01:10:00,530
recently and I think one of them does

1391
01:10:07,419 --> 01:10:04,940
involve a loss the tape tapes or

1392
01:10:09,310 --> 01:10:07,429
something to that to that effect yes but

1393
01:10:12,969 --> 01:10:09,320
again when you know it you know if

1394
01:10:15,219 --> 01:10:12,979
you're a hardcore investigator or even a

1395
01:10:17,049 --> 01:10:15,229
legitimate reader in this literature and

1396
01:10:19,509 --> 01:10:17,059
somebody tries to pull the wool over

1397
01:10:21,779 --> 01:10:19,519
your eyes you know you're just not going

1398
01:10:25,089 --> 01:10:21,789
to you know you've got to pass the

1399
01:10:26,739 --> 01:10:25,099
subject on by you know like as somebody

1400
01:10:29,140 --> 01:10:26,749
did a movie recently I think it's called

1401
01:10:31,270 --> 01:10:29,150
hangar 10 well there is no hangar 10

1402
01:10:34,029 --> 01:10:31,280
we're not even sure that hangar 8 exists

1403
01:10:37,479 --> 01:10:34,039
but if it does it surely isn't marked

1404
01:10:38,830 --> 01:10:37,489
you know hangar 10 by the way dr. Scott

1405
01:10:39,880 --> 01:10:38,840
is there a hangar 8 at the

1406
01:10:44,020 --> 01:10:39,890
wright-patterson Air for

1407
01:10:48,060 --> 01:10:44,030
space hangar 18 yeah a great teen yeah

1408
01:10:50,950 --> 01:10:48,070
yeah well I was actually on the runway

1409
01:10:54,160 --> 01:10:50,960
accidentally driving on the runway to

1410
01:10:56,320 --> 01:10:54,170
hangar 18 and made a film of it but

1411
01:11:01,570 --> 01:10:56,330
anyway I talked to some of the old

1412
01:11:04,690 --> 01:11:01,580
people of Dayton and they said that

1413
01:11:07,450 --> 01:11:04,700
actually there is a building that was

1414
01:11:09,850 --> 01:11:07,460
once called hangar 18 where they

1415
01:11:11,680 --> 01:11:09,860
unloaded the Roswell debris and the

1416
01:11:16,780 --> 01:11:11,690
building's still there it's a huge

1417
01:11:20,400 --> 01:11:16,790
hangar and once I was on base inside the

1418
01:11:22,510 --> 01:11:20,410
secured area driving around and

1419
01:11:24,910 --> 01:11:22,520
accidentally drove on the runway

1420
01:11:26,890 --> 01:11:24,920
reading clips too but I you know that's

1421
01:11:29,410 --> 01:11:26,900
what they said I don't know what any way

1422
01:11:32,650 --> 01:11:29,420
to check it but that's what some very

1423
01:11:33,970 --> 01:11:32,660
old um they didn't we got it we could I

1424
01:11:35,650 --> 01:11:33,980
ask you about the under get there are

1425
01:11:37,840 --> 01:11:35,660
underground tunnels and stuff there I

1426
01:11:39,610 --> 01:11:37,850
find that you write about it well but

1427
01:11:42,520 --> 01:11:39,620
we've got this guy coming in with his

1428
01:11:43,300 --> 01:11:42,530
big hammer and echoing - quiet us down

1429
01:11:47,680 --> 01:11:43,310
for a few minutes

1430
01:11:49,260 --> 01:11:47,690
well connect up again just a brief

1431
01:11:57,940 --> 01:11:49,270
period of time so stay tuned

1432
01:12:04,670 --> 01:12:02,090
now back to exploring the bazaar with

1433
01:12:05,780 --> 01:12:04,680
two of the most electrifying researchers

1434
01:12:09,200 --> 01:12:05,790
with paranoid

1435
01:12:16,190 --> 01:12:09,210
your hosts Timothy evacuate and Singh

1436
01:12:18,680 --> 01:12:16,200
Swartz once again Tim here we are we

1437
01:12:22,430 --> 01:12:18,690
have less than a half an hour left in

1438
01:12:25,910 --> 01:12:22,440
the program and there are still so many

1439
01:12:32,080 --> 01:12:25,920
questions that that I would like to ask

1440
01:12:35,090 --> 01:12:32,090
dr. Scott and and and break so let's

1441
01:12:36,950 --> 01:12:35,100
let's let's just get back to it dr.

1442
01:12:42,070 --> 01:12:36,960
Scott you mentioned during the break

1443
01:12:44,900 --> 01:12:42,080
that your your book goes right up into

1444
01:12:48,710 --> 01:12:44,910
recent times and I guess that you

1445
01:12:53,510 --> 01:12:48,720
entertained some other ideas on the the

1446
01:12:57,340 --> 01:12:53,520
possible origins of the UFOs yes it goes

1447
01:13:02,960 --> 01:12:57,350
up to recent times and I was comparing

1448
01:13:05,870 --> 01:13:02,970
the your the UFO phenomena has never

1449
01:13:10,300 --> 01:13:05,880
been understood and back in the 50s it

1450
01:13:13,460 --> 01:13:10,310
was kind of a nuts and bolts idea of

1451
01:13:16,580 --> 01:13:13,470
crafts and other plants or spaceships or

1452
01:13:19,520 --> 01:13:16,590
something like that and if you actually

1453
01:13:22,220 --> 01:13:19,530
I mean I've interview a lot of people

1454
01:13:24,920 --> 01:13:22,230
and they don't necessarily put something

1455
01:13:29,200 --> 01:13:24,930
like that they may report objects that

1456
01:13:31,580 --> 01:13:29,210
merge or go apart or go through walls or

1457
01:13:34,940 --> 01:13:31,590
beings that go through walls and all

1458
01:13:39,170 --> 01:13:34,950
kinds of things that don't fit a nuts

1459
01:13:42,740 --> 01:13:39,180
and bolts type of theory and after

1460
01:13:47,180 --> 01:13:42,750
thinking about for quite a while I think

1461
01:13:50,570 --> 01:13:47,190
that in one thing I'd like to postulate

1462
01:13:52,760 --> 01:13:50,580
is is that we aren't using the right

1463
01:13:55,940 --> 01:13:52,770
theories to try to understand the

1464
01:13:58,520 --> 01:13:55,950
phenomena we're using we're still saying

1465
01:14:00,890 --> 01:13:58,530
all these are spaceships and then we're

1466
01:14:03,440 --> 01:14:00,900
disagreeing with people about whether

1467
01:14:05,240 --> 01:14:03,450
spaceship could get here and saying well

1468
01:14:07,280 --> 01:14:05,250
everybody in the universe is just like

1469
01:14:09,860 --> 01:14:07,290
us and if we can't go to the Stars they

1470
01:14:12,950 --> 01:14:09,870
can't go to come and see us some things

1471
01:14:15,500 --> 01:14:12,960
besides that the phenomena itself

1472
01:14:21,200 --> 01:14:15,510
doesn't seem like spaceships it seems

1473
01:14:23,270 --> 01:14:21,210
like something else it it seems probably

1474
01:14:26,210 --> 01:14:23,280
is more complicated than even the idea

1475
01:14:29,080 --> 01:14:26,220
of spaceships and I was suggesting

1476
01:14:32,390 --> 01:14:29,090
instead of the old Newtonian

1477
01:14:34,610 --> 01:14:32,400
nuts-and-bolts observe the universe from

1478
01:14:37,580 --> 01:14:34,620
the outside next earthling idea in

1479
01:14:40,820 --> 01:14:37,590
science that the new science is a

1480
01:14:42,190 --> 01:14:40,830
quantum theory and with climb theory a

1481
01:14:48,590 --> 01:14:42,200
lot of the things that people report

1482
01:14:52,730 --> 01:14:48,600
could actually happen for example they

1483
01:14:55,520 --> 01:14:52,740
will say that maybe somebody will say

1484
01:14:58,310 --> 01:14:55,530
that they saw something go through the

1485
01:15:00,710 --> 01:14:58,320
wall and appear on the other side well

1486
01:15:04,220 --> 01:15:00,720
our ability understands it's very

1487
01:15:07,340 --> 01:15:04,230
primitive because we may shoot atomic

1488
01:15:10,540 --> 01:15:07,350
particles at a barrier and sometimes

1489
01:15:12,890 --> 01:15:10,550
they'll be on the other side which is

1490
01:15:14,780 --> 01:15:12,900
completely different than our theories

1491
01:15:17,260 --> 01:15:14,790
previous theories that that couldn't

1492
01:15:20,420 --> 01:15:17,270
happen but it's called it's dudn't

1493
01:15:24,560 --> 01:15:20,430
nonlocality of atomic particles they may

1494
01:15:26,630 --> 01:15:24,570
be anywhere and so something something

1495
01:15:29,570 --> 01:15:26,640
with more control and understanding the

1496
01:15:32,470 --> 01:15:29,580
quantum theory may be able to control

1497
01:15:36,970 --> 01:15:32,480
the way you go through a burial barrier

1498
01:15:39,950 --> 01:15:36,980
with different quantum particles - and

1499
01:15:43,760 --> 01:15:39,960
even in a nuts-and-bolts

1500
01:15:45,650 --> 01:15:43,770
idea they'll be talked about car stops

1501
01:15:47,720 --> 01:15:45,660
that this would be impossible and

1502
01:15:51,020 --> 01:15:47,730
couldn't possibly happen but you can

1503
01:15:54,050 --> 01:15:51,030
stop cars now electronically and so as

1504
01:15:58,700 --> 01:15:54,060
people develop more they probably need

1505
01:16:01,430 --> 01:15:58,710
more paradigms to explore the idea of

1506
01:16:03,860 --> 01:16:01,440
UFO phenomena instead you're saying well

1507
01:16:08,600 --> 01:16:03,870
these are spaceships so anyway that's

1508
01:16:12,550 --> 01:16:08,610
something I want to say well it seems to

1509
01:16:16,130 --> 01:16:12,560
me that possibly not only are we not

1510
01:16:18,940 --> 01:16:16,140
asking the right kind of questions

1511
01:16:23,350 --> 01:16:18,950
concerning UFOs but we just may be

1512
01:16:26,950 --> 01:16:23,360
currently just incapable of ass

1513
01:16:30,040 --> 01:16:26,960
the right kind of questions uh it's just

1514
01:16:32,680 --> 01:16:30,050
the the the the UFO phenomena you know

1515
01:16:34,959 --> 01:16:32,690
may be such a mystery that it's just

1516
01:16:37,990 --> 01:16:34,969
completely beyond us you know beyond our

1517
01:16:40,090 --> 01:16:38,000
understanding and who do we who do we

1518
01:16:42,340 --> 01:16:40,100
ask and expect to get an answer from

1519
01:16:48,300 --> 01:16:42,350
well at least ask me Tim I know

1520
01:16:50,649 --> 01:16:48,310
everything except yeah and if you and I

1521
01:16:54,060 --> 01:16:50,659
and to all of our listeners out there

1522
01:16:57,280 --> 01:16:54,070
you know anybody that you hear that says

1523
01:16:59,320 --> 01:16:57,290
that very thick thing you know yeah I

1524
01:17:03,970 --> 01:16:59,330
know all the answers about UFOs just

1525
01:17:06,939 --> 01:17:03,980
turn and walk away yeah yeah and tune it

1526
01:17:09,070 --> 01:17:06,949
to our show that's right hey yeah a

1527
01:17:11,080 --> 01:17:09,080
little better but it is it's true though

1528
01:17:13,600 --> 01:17:11,090
I think I mean I I think that you know

1529
01:17:16,439 --> 01:17:13,610
possibly we are dealing with a

1530
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:16,449
phenomenon that is just so completely

1531
01:17:25,660 --> 01:17:21,130
beyond what what our puny little minds

1532
01:17:28,479 --> 01:17:25,670
can conceive that I mean we we're not

1533
01:17:32,200 --> 01:17:28,489
going to be able to really get any

1534
01:17:34,180 --> 01:17:32,210
answers and I think though that we

1535
01:17:35,410 --> 01:17:34,190
instead of looking for answers I think

1536
01:17:39,209 --> 01:17:35,420
we should just look for a better

1537
01:17:43,149 --> 01:17:39,219
understanding of what we're dealing with

1538
01:17:44,229 --> 01:17:43,159
or maybe the whole purpose here is for

1539
01:17:48,189 --> 01:17:44,239
us to think

1540
01:17:50,260 --> 01:17:48,199
I mean I've often said to myself Oh UFOs

1541
01:17:53,080 --> 01:17:50,270
you know they might be physical crafts

1542
01:17:55,570 --> 01:17:53,090
sometimes they could be you know from

1543
01:17:58,390 --> 01:17:55,580
other dimensions but if nothing else

1544
01:18:00,939 --> 01:17:58,400
they are at they are a cosmic puzzle in

1545
01:18:02,439 --> 01:18:00,949
a riddle and and a lot of people have

1546
01:18:04,359 --> 01:18:02,449
put their their best

1547
01:18:06,970 --> 01:18:04,369
you know intelligence forward in trying

1548
01:18:10,209 --> 01:18:06,980
to decipher this it is kind of a a

1549
01:18:15,550 --> 01:18:10,219
cosmic chess game and I know it's kept

1550
01:18:18,609 --> 01:18:15,560
me riveted and entertained it for a half

1551
01:18:22,689 --> 01:18:18,619
a century or more as it has a rikiya

1552
01:18:25,450 --> 01:18:22,699
hilberg over there in Cleveland Ohio now

1553
01:18:27,760 --> 01:18:25,460
Rick how is your opinions on all this a

1554
01:18:29,500 --> 01:18:27,770
change I mean you know when we first

1555
01:18:31,660 --> 01:18:29,510
started you know and I had my little

1556
01:18:33,609 --> 01:18:31,670
mimeograph machine there

1557
01:18:36,189 --> 01:18:33,619
hey in fact you know you said you had a

1558
01:18:37,270 --> 01:18:36,199
copy of my inside the saucers book I got

1559
01:18:39,670 --> 01:18:37,280
to get you the car

1560
01:18:41,800 --> 01:18:39,680
for me I I i that's the one thing that I

1561
01:18:44,830 --> 01:18:41,810
don't have a copy of I don't know if you

1562
01:18:48,820 --> 01:18:44,840
could copy oh yeah it really copy the

1563
01:18:50,530 --> 01:18:48,830
purple ink or not I'll take it to the

1564
01:18:54,010 --> 01:18:50,540
printer I'm sure she can do something

1565
01:18:55,120 --> 01:18:54,020
hey but anyway I mean you know our our

1566
01:18:57,180 --> 01:18:55,130
publication was called the

1567
01:19:00,220 --> 01:18:57,190
interplanetary News Service report

1568
01:19:02,620 --> 01:19:00,230
because we thought that UFOs were from

1569
01:19:04,900 --> 01:19:02,630
outer space I mean if George Adamski

1570
01:19:07,140 --> 01:19:04,910
told the so a major Keyhoe told us so

1571
01:19:10,420 --> 01:19:07,150
well then it had to be true right

1572
01:19:13,560 --> 01:19:10,430
yeah yeah they were the experts

1573
01:19:16,060 --> 01:19:13,570
it wasn't till Ray Palmer came along and

1574
01:19:18,760 --> 01:19:16,070
threw a monkey wrench into all of this

1575
01:19:24,250 --> 01:19:18,770
and suggested that UFOs might be from

1576
01:19:26,710 --> 01:19:24,260
the Hollow Earth which we know which we

1577
01:19:28,480 --> 01:19:26,720
know which we know can be which we know

1578
01:19:33,070 --> 01:19:28,490
can't be true because the earth is flat

1579
01:19:35,080 --> 01:19:33,080
right yes everybody knows there's yes in

1580
01:19:37,170 --> 01:19:35,090
fact do you know that I was going to say

1581
01:19:40,060 --> 01:19:37,180
these morons but I don't want to be

1582
01:19:43,990 --> 01:19:40,070
judgmental have actually paid for a

1583
01:19:47,500 --> 01:19:44,000
billboard to be erected somewhere you

1584
01:19:49,900 --> 01:19:47,510
know if it's telling people of a pass

1585
01:19:53,260 --> 01:19:49,910
along the highway that uh that the the

1586
01:19:56,080 --> 01:19:53,270
earth is flat now I mean I think watch

1587
01:19:58,240 --> 01:19:56,090
why not drive you may fall yeah I think

1588
01:19:58,870 --> 01:19:58,250
that's one Syria could quickly throw out

1589
01:20:01,600 --> 01:19:58,880
the window

1590
01:20:04,710 --> 01:20:01,610
you know I I believe I don't think

1591
01:20:07,840 --> 01:20:04,720
there's anything to that one it it all

1592
01:20:10,060 --> 01:20:07,850
you know I'm not even sure that anybody

1593
01:20:12,490 --> 01:20:10,070
ever believes that you know I I think

1594
01:20:14,620 --> 01:20:12,500
going back in and you know I think was

1595
01:20:17,650 --> 01:20:14,630
travel going on all over the world I

1596
01:20:20,200 --> 01:20:17,660
mean if you go up in fact we're going to

1597
01:20:23,350 --> 01:20:20,210
have on in a couple of weeks the fellow

1598
01:20:26,730 --> 01:20:23,360
I believe his name is Tim amirite his

1599
01:20:30,400 --> 01:20:26,740
name is dr. stone he runs the the

1600
01:20:32,170 --> 01:20:30,410
Stonehenge yeah yeah his name is Stone

1601
01:20:35,380 --> 01:20:32,180
isn't that another weird synchronicity

1602
01:20:40,260 --> 01:20:35,390
there I uh yeah but you know I mean they

1603
01:20:43,300 --> 01:20:40,270
they date some of these you know uh the

1604
01:20:45,130 --> 01:20:43,310
huts and stone Hut's and all some of

1605
01:20:47,230 --> 01:20:45,140
which are very very tiny it with almost

1606
01:20:49,150 --> 01:20:47,240
seems like they were made for elementals

1607
01:20:51,070 --> 01:20:49,160
or fairies or something going back at

1608
01:20:53,110 --> 01:20:51,080
you know the lobby

1609
01:20:55,810 --> 01:20:53,120
even the Native Americans lived in the

1610
01:20:59,440 --> 01:20:55,820
in the area there I mean maybe it was a

1611
01:21:01,780 --> 01:20:59,450
you know Yukon the Viking was the same

1612
01:21:03,670 --> 01:21:01,790
Viking a guy that came along there at

1613
01:21:06,610 --> 01:21:03,680
some point

1614
01:21:09,400 --> 01:21:06,620
Eirik the Viking but liberated read yeah

1615
01:21:11,350 --> 01:21:09,410
yeah yeah leaves Italy okay but maybe it

1616
01:21:13,390 --> 01:21:11,360
wasn't I don't know we don't know they

1617
01:21:15,310 --> 01:21:13,400
were they were traveling all over the

1618
01:21:17,290 --> 01:21:15,320
world so they knew that they were the

1619
01:21:19,960 --> 01:21:17,300
earth wasn't flat I think they just

1620
01:21:22,300 --> 01:21:19,970
tried to propagate that that theory so

1621
01:21:23,680 --> 01:21:22,310
that people wouldn't get in a boat and

1622
01:21:26,490 --> 01:21:23,690
go out and look for the riches because

1623
01:21:28,390 --> 01:21:26,500
whoever knew that the earth was round

1624
01:21:32,170 --> 01:21:28,400
you know didn't want anybody else

1625
01:21:34,840 --> 01:21:32,180
Horning in on their territory and so

1626
01:21:37,290 --> 01:21:34,850
dear friends out there don't send me any

1627
01:21:40,180 --> 01:21:37,300
more emails about the earth being flat

1628
01:21:42,760 --> 01:21:40,190
because we certainly we certainly know

1629
01:21:44,140 --> 01:21:42,770
that they are not so a Rick what what

1630
01:21:46,000 --> 01:21:44,150
have you what have you been working on

1631
01:21:48,250 --> 01:21:46,010
over there in Ohio I mean if you have

1632
01:21:53,310 --> 01:21:48,260
any recent case of histories you've been

1633
01:21:55,780 --> 01:21:53,320
working on well I mean we got yeah we

1634
01:21:57,640 --> 01:21:55,790
basically I've been into doing

1635
01:22:00,730 --> 01:21:57,650
historical research now for the past

1636
01:22:02,560 --> 01:22:00,740
maybe 20 years and that's where I spend

1637
01:22:04,210 --> 01:22:02,570
most of my time on besides putting our

1638
01:22:05,800 --> 01:22:04,220
flying saucer digest and doing

1639
01:22:09,280 --> 01:22:05,810
up-to-date stuff and theories and

1640
01:22:11,320 --> 01:22:09,290
articles and stuff but every year we we

1641
01:22:14,680 --> 01:22:11,330
try to come out with a little

1642
01:22:17,620 --> 01:22:14,690
compilations little you know manuscripts

1643
01:22:19,240 --> 01:22:17,630
with with various historical sightings

1644
01:22:21,850 --> 01:22:19,250
in the very sky we've done stuff on

1645
01:22:24,280 --> 01:22:21,860
Bigfoot we've done stuff on ice falls in

1646
01:22:26,560 --> 01:22:24,290
angel hair you know that sort of things

1647
01:22:29,440 --> 01:22:26,570
right that I mean it's just researching

1648
01:22:31,330 --> 01:22:29,450
I'm busy going through old newspaper

1649
01:22:33,850 --> 01:22:31,340
clippings and books and cataloging

1650
01:22:35,590 --> 01:22:33,860
everything together and trying to to get

1651
01:22:39,810 --> 01:22:35,600
it into print one way or the other so

1652
01:22:44,770 --> 01:22:39,820
well you know Ohio Ohio was at one point

1653
01:22:46,630 --> 01:22:44,780
really the good hub of UFO activity of

1654
01:22:50,170 --> 01:22:46,640
course I'm wondering if you you know I'm

1655
01:22:52,540 --> 01:22:50,180
wondering if it isn't like associated

1656
01:22:55,420 --> 01:22:52,550
with like the media I mean in the end

1657
01:22:57,550 --> 01:22:55,430
the old good old days right you had her

1658
01:23:00,310 --> 01:22:57,560
own nest that you had the ufology

1659
01:23:04,180 --> 01:23:00,320
roundtable so there were there were

1660
01:23:04,990 --> 01:23:04,190
there was a you know a way of keeping

1661
01:23:07,570 --> 01:23:05,000
the public

1662
01:23:10,390 --> 01:23:07,580
formed on this there are a lot of

1663
01:23:12,280 --> 01:23:10,400
podcasts of course that now but that did

1664
01:23:13,930 --> 01:23:12,290
not then that really is local lot you

1665
01:23:16,270 --> 01:23:13,940
know they're not really localized that

1666
01:23:17,740 --> 01:23:16,280
if somebody is hearing the show in

1667
01:23:19,990 --> 01:23:17,750
Minneapolis they're going to call up the

1668
01:23:21,880 --> 01:23:20,000
station and tell about their you know

1669
01:23:25,120 --> 01:23:21,890
their their sightings of their encounter

1670
01:23:26,740 --> 01:23:25,130
or something like that one of the early

1671
01:23:28,660 --> 01:23:26,750
days here in Ohio I mean you're right

1672
01:23:31,900 --> 01:23:28,670
there were a number of UFO groups just

1673
01:23:35,140 --> 01:23:31,910
in the Cleveland area alone there were

1674
01:23:39,190 --> 01:23:35,150
there were at one time there were like

1675
01:23:41,770 --> 01:23:39,200
three or four going and you had two in

1676
01:23:44,050 --> 01:23:41,780
Akron and that's all within you know

1677
01:23:46,030 --> 01:23:44,060
just the radius of 50 miles so what was

1678
01:23:47,980 --> 01:23:46,040
it there it wasn't there even a tease

1679
01:23:50,770 --> 01:23:47,990
what was it there even a good year

1680
01:23:52,900 --> 01:23:50,780
UFO group yeah that's one of the two

1681
01:23:55,210 --> 01:23:52,910
from Akron you had the you had a flying

1682
01:23:57,550 --> 01:23:55,220
saucer investigating committee and then

1683
01:23:59,950 --> 01:23:57,560
you had the Goodyear UFO Society yeah it

1684
01:24:02,380 --> 01:23:59,960
was it was a corporate sponsored they

1685
01:24:05,140 --> 01:24:02,390
sponsored clubs and groups and whatnot

1686
01:24:07,930 --> 01:24:05,150
this was a corporate sponsored group

1687
01:24:10,900 --> 01:24:07,940
that investigated and had UFO fans

1688
01:24:12,940 --> 01:24:10,910
getting together yeah and whichever was

1689
01:24:14,440 --> 01:24:12,950
before there was any media attention one

1690
01:24:15,760 --> 01:24:14,450
before there's media attention though

1691
01:24:18,130 --> 01:24:15,770
there were Ohio groups that were

1692
01:24:21,820 --> 01:24:18,140
flourishing before the ufology

1693
01:24:24,400 --> 01:24:21,830
roundtable on KYW long before that there

1694
01:24:26,110 --> 01:24:24,410
were holding meetings and publishing

1695
01:24:28,600 --> 01:24:26,120
little newsletters and coming out with

1696
01:24:31,350 --> 01:24:28,610
case histories so some reason rather

1697
01:24:34,540 --> 01:24:31,360
Ohio has always been a hot bed for

1698
01:24:36,610 --> 01:24:34,550
enthusiastic people you know reporting

1699
01:24:38,320 --> 01:24:36,620
and getting together discussing UFOs

1700
01:24:40,900 --> 01:24:38,330
let's put it that way well well you know

1701
01:24:42,760 --> 01:24:40,910
and now we notice we've had a one of our

1702
01:24:45,760 --> 01:24:42,770
guests we've had on quite a few times as

1703
01:24:48,880 --> 01:24:45,770
Paulino from new exact you have to be

1704
01:24:51,490 --> 01:24:48,890
from Rhode Island but there's a lot you

1705
01:24:53,140 --> 01:24:51,500
know again once you get people that you

1706
01:24:55,590 --> 01:24:53,150
know together and sift through all this

1707
01:24:58,930 --> 01:24:55,600
information you'll find that there are

1708
01:25:01,210 --> 01:24:58,940
quite a few hot spots going on but

1709
01:25:04,870 --> 01:25:01,220
unless you have the ability to kind of

1710
01:25:07,900 --> 01:25:04,880
collect this information in and you know

1711
01:25:09,490 --> 01:25:07,910
Corral it so to speak most people are

1712
01:25:11,830 --> 01:25:09,500
just not familiar with what might be

1713
01:25:14,230 --> 01:25:11,840
going on in their own little area like

1714
01:25:17,410 --> 01:25:14,240
we went to Pine Bush a couple of weeks

1715
01:25:18,880 --> 01:25:17,420
ago I mean who would think that the most

1716
01:25:21,730 --> 01:25:18,890
of the events there were in ninth

1717
01:25:26,190 --> 01:25:21,740
80 that there would still be you know

1718
01:25:29,320 --> 01:25:26,200
interest there and in the UFOs and

1719
01:25:31,780 --> 01:25:29,330
aliens and the weird lights in the sky

1720
01:25:35,110 --> 01:25:31,790
and things to that effect but here's a

1721
01:25:38,710 --> 01:25:35,120
little community it's not even a city or

1722
01:25:41,110 --> 01:25:38,720
a town it's a hamlet and of about

1723
01:25:42,940 --> 01:25:41,120
fourteen hundred people or so and and

1724
01:25:48,130 --> 01:25:42,950
they still once a year have their UFO a

1725
01:25:49,570 --> 01:25:48,140
you know a parade and UFO festival and I

1726
01:25:51,760 --> 01:25:49,580
guess they're quite a number of places

1727
01:25:54,100 --> 01:25:51,770
at Tim am i right around the country now

1728
01:25:55,810 --> 01:25:54,110
that are having a affairs like that of

1729
01:25:57,340 --> 01:25:55,820
course the big one would be in Roswell I

1730
01:25:59,560 --> 01:25:57,350
mean that's been drawing people now for

1731
01:26:00,250 --> 01:25:59,570
I know what twenty five years or

1732
01:26:03,280 --> 01:26:00,260
something like that

1733
01:26:07,020 --> 01:26:03,290
oh yeah well and there's the join

1734
01:26:10,120 --> 01:26:07,030
everyone in Hopkinsville Kentucky I

1735
01:26:13,450 --> 01:26:10,130
think it's a next month or in August you

1736
01:26:20,130 --> 01:26:13,460
know with the the Hopkinsville creatures

1737
01:26:22,180 --> 01:26:20,140
should we bring our own shotguns yeah

1738
01:26:24,250 --> 01:26:22,190
that would be that would be a good idea

1739
01:26:26,440 --> 01:26:24,260
you have a shooting gallery there you

1740
01:26:28,360 --> 01:26:26,450
know you put a little creatures up on

1741
01:26:31,120 --> 01:26:28,370
the roof and everybody gets a you know a

1742
01:26:34,540 --> 01:26:31,130
a shot or two with a little a little

1743
01:26:36,670 --> 01:26:34,550
better I'm sure probably somebody is

1744
01:26:40,540 --> 01:26:36,680
thought of that already it's a good idea

1745
01:26:44,410 --> 01:26:40,550
though let me I should be the king of

1746
01:26:47,260 --> 01:26:44,420
the UFO festivals oh I am how to draw in

1747
01:26:50,140 --> 01:26:47,270
in the people we're going to have fun in

1748
01:26:52,420 --> 01:26:50,150
if you had a UFO festival in Cleveland

1749
01:26:54,300 --> 01:26:52,430
Rick where what what what place would be

1750
01:26:59,560 --> 01:26:54,310
the most memorable that people would

1751
01:27:01,510 --> 01:26:59,570
recall do you think you mean it was

1752
01:27:03,160 --> 01:27:01,520
we've already held or fishin I don't

1753
01:27:05,200 --> 01:27:03,170
know what no I mean like if you did a

1754
01:27:05,560 --> 01:27:05,210
UFO parade or a festival or something

1755
01:27:07,750 --> 01:27:05,570
like that

1756
01:27:10,210 --> 01:27:07,760
is there one key spot where people would

1757
01:27:14,200 --> 01:27:10,220
say oh I remember that or or you know I

1758
01:27:15,610 --> 01:27:14,210
gosh not really not really no we did we

1759
01:27:18,040 --> 01:27:15,620
just had a number of good to know

1760
01:27:20,860 --> 01:27:18,050
blockbuster cases from the closest thing

1761
01:27:22,750 --> 01:27:20,870
we had it was was the one that dr. Scott

1762
01:27:27,160 --> 01:27:22,760
talked about was the ravenna case time

1763
01:27:28,750 --> 01:27:27,170
and you know back in 1966 that's really

1764
01:27:30,550 --> 01:27:28,760
the biggest media attention saying

1765
01:27:32,620 --> 01:27:30,560
course you had the coin helicopter case

1766
01:27:34,600 --> 01:27:32,630
that was the enhanced field though s

1767
01:27:36,729 --> 01:27:34,610
not from Cleveland so no we will never

1768
01:27:38,520 --> 01:27:36,739
really had a black a black Buster case

1769
01:27:41,439 --> 01:27:38,530
in Cleveland

1770
01:27:43,570 --> 01:27:41,449
well you've had now what was the you've

1771
01:27:46,060 --> 01:27:43,580
had a lot of creature sightings or

1772
01:27:49,060 --> 01:27:46,070
Bigfoot sightings and things I mean that

1773
01:27:51,820 --> 01:27:49,070
is Ohio is a hotbed not around here but

1774
01:27:55,419 --> 01:27:51,830
but Ohio it there's a high OH Bigfoot

1775
01:27:57,850 --> 01:27:55,429
festival down I think it's a Salt Fork

1776
01:28:00,160 --> 01:27:57,860
or one of these state parks are State

1777
01:28:02,379 --> 01:28:00,170
Forest or something every they have it

1778
01:28:04,570 --> 01:28:02,389
just about every May and it's just a few

1779
01:28:07,120 --> 01:28:04,580
weeks ago and they drew hundreds and

1780
01:28:08,700 --> 01:28:07,130
hundreds of people and there the Ohio

1781
01:28:11,590 --> 01:28:08,710
people claim that there are a number of

1782
01:28:14,860 --> 01:28:11,600
credible cases of bigfoot-like creatures

1783
01:28:19,060 --> 01:28:14,870
being sighted and in southeastern Ohio

1784
01:28:21,669 --> 01:28:19,070
yeah and and I mean what is the the the

1785
01:28:24,669 --> 01:28:21,679
standing as far as these Bigfoot people

1786
01:28:26,140 --> 01:28:24,679
go in and UFOs I mean people you know

1787
01:28:29,260 --> 01:28:26,150
some people have seen a direct

1788
01:28:29,709 --> 01:28:29,270
correlation or a connection between the

1789
01:28:33,879 --> 01:28:29,719
two

1790
01:28:36,610 --> 01:28:33,889
I mean are these like you know people

1791
01:28:40,959 --> 01:28:36,620
that are into the just in the the

1792
01:28:44,140 --> 01:28:40,969
hardcore Bigfoot reports you know that

1793
01:28:46,030 --> 01:28:44,150
in most of any no they're not really

1794
01:28:47,800 --> 01:28:46,040
into UFOs that's one of those things

1795
01:28:50,110 --> 01:28:47,810
like the science fiction people in the

1796
01:28:52,379 --> 01:28:50,120
UFO people know my god it's the same

1797
01:28:54,850 --> 01:28:52,389
with the Bigfoot people you know it

1798
01:28:57,070 --> 01:28:54,860
there there have been a number of cases

1799
01:29:00,100 --> 01:28:57,080
like Stan Gordon investigated and now he

1800
01:29:02,050 --> 01:29:00,110
has a number of a minute 7 where there

1801
01:29:04,000 --> 01:29:02,060
was a connection and Butch will

1802
01:29:06,010 --> 01:29:04,010
Wollensky that we've had on the program

1803
01:29:08,830 --> 01:29:06,020
a couple of times said yeah yeah brought

1804
01:29:10,990 --> 01:29:08,840
us together and and even at the Paulino

1805
01:29:13,209 --> 01:29:11,000
now he goes out to this place in

1806
01:29:14,800 --> 01:29:13,219
Pennsylvania and they sit around in the

1807
01:29:16,629 --> 01:29:14,810
Bigfoot brushes up against the

1808
01:29:20,800 --> 01:29:16,639
automobile while they watch UFOs in the

1809
01:29:23,140 --> 01:29:20,810
sky but about the people in organized

1810
01:29:25,510 --> 01:29:23,150
Bigfoot researcher big pathology

1811
01:29:27,669 --> 01:29:25,520
whatever you want they I mean UFO know

1812
01:29:29,979 --> 01:29:27,679
that the two don't mix you just have

1813
01:29:31,810 --> 01:29:29,989
nothing to do say you know they they

1814
01:29:34,660 --> 01:29:31,820
think we're the crackpots and maybe we

1815
01:29:40,000 --> 01:29:34,670
think they're the crap we hope you know

1816
01:29:41,709 --> 01:29:40,010
long well I you know I I I don't know I

1817
01:29:43,510 --> 01:29:41,719
mean I I've always been interested in

1818
01:29:46,010 --> 01:29:43,520
Bigfoot but I could never get really

1819
01:29:50,000 --> 01:29:47,840
by it you know I mean if it's a big

1820
01:29:53,810 --> 01:29:50,010
hairy beast well leave it alone and let

1821
01:29:56,510 --> 01:29:53,820
it wander in the and the wilderness but

1822
01:29:59,959 --> 01:29:56,520
we're getting out to the last five or

1823
01:30:01,970 --> 01:29:59,969
six minutes here of our program and I do

1824
01:30:03,650 --> 01:30:01,980
want to go around the table of one last

1825
01:30:06,290 --> 01:30:03,660
time so you can all tell us about what

1826
01:30:08,060 --> 01:30:06,300
you're working on now dr. Scott are you

1827
01:30:11,540 --> 01:30:08,070
giving any talks anywhere are you are

1828
01:30:17,180 --> 01:30:11,550
the lecture circuit I sort of am I gave

1829
01:30:19,729 --> 01:30:17,190
one um a cup this weekend I mean last

1830
01:30:23,120 --> 01:30:19,739
weekend and I have two more scheduled

1831
01:30:24,530 --> 01:30:23,130
there in Ohio though oh well that's okay

1832
01:30:28,459 --> 01:30:24,540
we have listen I'm sure we have

1833
01:30:30,979 --> 01:30:28,469
listeners in Ohio Rick is listening we

1834
01:30:33,410 --> 01:30:30,989
have what did you tell worthy of who's

1835
01:30:37,430 --> 01:30:33,420
sponsoring the event well I've been

1836
01:30:40,490 --> 01:30:37,440
invited to the Cleveland UFO group which

1837
01:30:43,670 --> 01:30:40,500
he knows about and I'm still trying to

1838
01:30:47,209 --> 01:30:43,680
figure out what date to go and then I've

1839
01:30:51,170 --> 01:30:47,219
been invited to give one for Ohio MUFON

1840
01:30:55,040 --> 01:30:51,180
next month and so I'm preparing and

1841
01:30:56,900 --> 01:30:55,050
trying to get ready and well your book

1842
01:31:00,440 --> 01:30:56,910
should be well-received certainly by the

1843
01:31:02,270 --> 01:31:00,450
MUFON organization I would I would I

1844
01:31:04,900 --> 01:31:02,280
would think I mean because it's got a

1845
01:31:07,970 --> 01:31:04,910
lot of the hardcore cases that they're

1846
01:31:10,600 --> 01:31:07,980
that they're you know interested in and

1847
01:31:12,680 --> 01:31:10,610
kind of brings it out there at

1848
01:31:16,880 --> 01:31:12,690
pseudo-scientific efforts to investigate

1849
01:31:20,390 --> 01:31:16,890
the you know the the cases and and Rick

1850
01:31:22,370 --> 01:31:20,400
do you have anything planned well what

1851
01:31:24,140 --> 01:31:22,380
we're doing well what we're doing is

1852
01:31:26,959 --> 01:31:24,150
we're planning on putting in the 50th

1853
01:31:28,700 --> 01:31:26,969
anniversary issue of fine saucer digest

1854
01:31:30,850 --> 01:31:28,710
at respect will be stirred we've already

1855
01:31:32,930 --> 01:31:30,860
started work on on the issue itself

1856
01:31:35,060 --> 01:31:32,940
gathering stuff together and that will

1857
01:31:38,209 --> 01:31:35,070
be coming out sometime in July so that

1858
01:31:40,580 --> 01:31:38,219
will be our big five oh and and what

1859
01:31:42,800 --> 01:31:40,590
what do you find that people are mainly

1860
01:31:47,150 --> 01:31:42,810
interested in that are on your mailing

1861
01:31:49,760 --> 01:31:47,160
list they just want to hear about what's

1862
01:31:51,890 --> 01:31:49,770
going on in the UFO field and they also

1863
01:31:53,930 --> 01:31:51,900
like some of the speckle speculative

1864
01:31:57,170 --> 01:31:53,940
articles will be presenting new and

1865
01:31:59,070 --> 01:31:57,180
there's a lot of support for we run 14

1866
01:32:02,760 --> 01:31:59,080
items to we've I was just going to

1867
01:32:04,590 --> 01:32:02,770
yeah yeah I mean are there like objects

1868
01:32:06,780 --> 01:32:04,600
that falling from the sky and things

1869
01:32:09,090 --> 01:32:06,790
along oh yeah yeah we've got people that

1870
01:32:11,910 --> 01:32:09,100
really did get in is one fellow his name

1871
01:32:13,920 --> 01:32:11,920
is Martin Pitroda and he's firms your

1872
01:32:17,850 --> 01:32:13,930
Scranton Pennsylvania is the most

1873
01:32:19,890 --> 01:32:17,860
fantastic 14 researcher you ever want to

1874
01:32:22,650 --> 01:32:19,900
meet he puts out all kinds of little

1875
01:32:25,290 --> 01:32:22,660
monographs and whatnot on the various

1876
01:32:27,990 --> 01:32:25,300
you know 14 cases and aspects and

1877
01:32:30,450 --> 01:32:28,000
theories and but you know he writes a

1878
01:32:32,010 --> 01:32:30,460
lot of articles for us graciously and

1879
01:32:33,690 --> 01:32:32,020
our people really dig it now what they

1880
01:32:37,230 --> 01:32:33,700
like to hear these kind of people who

1881
01:32:39,750 --> 01:32:37,240
are into UFOs also seem to have an open

1882
01:32:43,650 --> 01:32:39,760
mind obviously gels they like to hear

1883
01:32:47,450 --> 01:32:43,660
about the 14 things also and and 10 what

1884
01:32:51,660 --> 01:32:47,460
would you be up to oh my gosh Tim well

1885
01:32:55,400 --> 01:32:51,670
you know I'm still trying to actively

1886
01:32:59,820 --> 01:32:55,410
promote our most recent book the the

1887
01:33:01,590 --> 01:32:59,830
pill okay matrix a Filipina a dick you

1888
01:33:04,380 --> 01:33:01,600
know that we just finished that and just

1889
01:33:07,020 --> 01:33:04,390
you know we've gotten well in fact I've

1890
01:33:09,120 --> 01:33:07,030
decided that I'm taking let's see the

1891
01:33:11,610 --> 01:33:09,130
next the month or so instead of writing

1892
01:33:16,160 --> 01:33:11,620
and putting up more books you and I will

1893
01:33:18,600 --> 01:33:16,170
be going on a cross-country podcast tour

1894
01:33:22,440 --> 01:33:18,610
well I think I think that's an excellent

1895
01:33:23,910 --> 01:33:22,450
idea because I mean really I you know of

1896
01:33:25,830 --> 01:33:23,920
all the recent books that we put out

1897
01:33:27,810 --> 01:33:25,840
this one I think is you know I'm

1898
01:33:32,070 --> 01:33:27,820
extremely proud of this book and it's

1899
01:33:34,370 --> 01:33:32,080
just a really excellent excellent book

1900
01:33:36,990 --> 01:33:34,380
that everyone should should really read

1901
01:33:41,670 --> 01:33:37,000
well I I think we but we've been working

1902
01:33:43,560 --> 01:33:41,680
extra hard and you know it I think our

1903
01:33:45,690 --> 01:33:43,570
efforts you know as we go along I always

1904
01:33:49,050 --> 01:33:45,700
keep saying that oh this is going to be

1905
01:33:52,820 --> 01:33:49,060
my last a book I've run out of ideas and

1906
01:33:56,220 --> 01:33:52,830
I think we're 269 books into it now and

1907
01:33:59,760 --> 01:33:56,230
every day I seem to come up with another

1908
01:34:02,040 --> 01:33:59,770
idea I know there's a kind of a book in

1909
01:34:03,540 --> 01:34:02,050
the works on the knight Templar and the

1910
01:34:07,100 --> 01:34:03,550
treasures that they buried around the

1911
01:34:11,610 --> 01:34:07,110
country and I'm thinking about doing a

1912
01:34:12,959 --> 01:34:11,620
little book on a phantom ships and

1913
01:34:15,330 --> 01:34:12,969
ghosts

1914
01:34:18,149 --> 01:34:15,340
you know like the Lost Dutchman the

1915
01:34:20,819 --> 01:34:18,159
flying dutchman right some of those

1916
01:34:25,620 --> 01:34:20,829
cases have very much intrigued me over

1917
01:34:27,229 --> 01:34:25,630
the years so they many have tried but

1918
01:34:29,969 --> 01:34:27,239
none have been able to put us down

1919
01:34:33,509 --> 01:34:29,979
mm-hmm next week we're going to have a

1920
01:34:38,100 --> 01:34:33,519
really good show as well we're going to

1921
01:34:41,089 --> 01:34:38,110
have a program on occult icons pop

1922
01:34:44,839 --> 01:34:41,099
culture icons like Kenneth Wagner and

1923
01:34:48,439 --> 01:34:44,849
philip k dick and Robert Anton Wilson

1924
01:34:52,049 --> 01:34:48,449
and it's going to be a very interesting

1925
01:34:54,540 --> 01:34:52,059
program and of course you can keep up

1926
01:34:56,879 --> 01:34:54,550
with us the show will be archived here

1927
01:35:00,719 --> 01:34:56,889
you know all our programs are archived

1928
01:35:03,390 --> 01:35:00,729
on kco our radio.com and then of course

1929
01:35:06,209 --> 01:35:03,400
and now we have our own YouTube channel

1930
01:35:09,209 --> 01:35:06,219
where we've got about 180 videos up

1931
01:35:12,359 --> 01:35:09,219
there that's mr. UFO secret files and we

1932
01:35:15,089 --> 01:35:12,369
keep a very active Facebook presence and

1933
01:35:16,410 --> 01:35:15,099
we're always happy to hear from people

1934
01:35:17,729 --> 01:35:16,420
who want to be on the mailing list and

1935
01:35:19,529 --> 01:35:17,739
we've got newsletters who said that

1936
01:35:21,569 --> 01:35:19,539
we're still printing our own literature

1937
01:35:23,759 --> 01:35:21,579
and that's a good thing in this day and

1938
01:35:27,239 --> 01:35:23,769
age and I want to thank our guests for

1939
01:35:29,850 --> 01:35:27,249
being with us tonight and Tim we're

1940
01:35:31,799 --> 01:35:29,860
always welcome in my living room good

1941
01:35:34,529 --> 01:35:31,809
night all good night everybody and you

1942
01:35:37,700 --> 01:35:34,539
have a wonderful time and safe it god

1943
01:35:44,070 --> 01:35:40,649
you've been listening to exploring the

1944
01:35:47,280 --> 01:35:44,080
bazaar with hosts Timothy Beckley and

1945
01:35:49,560 --> 01:35:47,290
King Swartz they're taking back the

1946
01:35:52,110 --> 01:35:49,570
night by jetting non-stop apart the

1947
01:35:55,740 --> 01:35:52,120
puzzles in search of the truly bizarre

1948
01:35:58,950 --> 01:35:55,750
and totally explain with you as their

1949
01:35:59,729 --> 01:35:58,960
combined Thursday nights at 7:00 p.m.

1950
01:36:04,850 --> 01:35:59,739
Pacific

1951
01:36:07,860 --> 01:36:04,860
10:00 p.m. on the K cor digital radio

1952
01:36:11,129 --> 01:36:07,870
for more information on exploring the

1953
01:36:13,439 --> 01:36:11,139
bizarre and host Timothy Beckley and to

1954
01:36:16,649 --> 01:36:13,449
swartz check out their case do our

1955
01:36:22,709 --> 01:36:16,659
digital radio network follow their

1956
01:36:33,810 --> 01:36:22,719
YouTube channel @m our UFO 1100 explore